Subject: Re: Changing Religion Requirements
Subject: Students Holding Up
Subject: Freshman Classes--please suggest
Subject: Re: Freshman Classes--please suggest
Subject: none
Subject: Re: general education
Subject: Freshman Ed. and Transfer Students
Subject: How is this for a Freshman Year?
Subject: none
Subject: Re: How is this for a Freshman Year?
Subject: Re: How is this for a Freshman Year?
Subject: Re: How is this for a Freshman Year?
Subject: Re: How is this for a Freshman Year?
Subject: Computing, History and Social Science as Freshmen
Subject: Re: Computing, History and Social Science as Freshmen
Subject: Re: Computing, History and Social Science as Freshmen
Subject: Re: Computing in Freshman Year
Subject: Re: Computing in Freshman Year
Subject: Re: How is this for a Freshman Year?
Subject:
Subject: Re: How is this for a Freshman Year?
Subject: Freshman Experience is more than Courses
Subject: none
Subject: Re: Freshman Experience is more than Courses
Subject: Re: Freshman Year Experience
Subject: none
Subject: A 4-Year Schedule
Subject: Portfolio Topics
Subject: Philosophy of Service Course
Subject: Re: A 4-Year Schedule
Subject: Re: Portfolio Topics
Subject: Re: Philosophy of Service Course
Subject: Why require Philosophy of Service
Subject: Re: Why require Philosophy of Service
Subject: Re: A 4-Year Schedule
Subject: Re: Why require Philosophy of Service
Subject: Re: A 4-Year Schedule
Subject: Re: Why a separate Philosophy Class II
Subject: Re: Portfolio Topics
Subject: Re: Why require Philosophy of Service
Subject: Re: A 4-Year Schedule
Subject: 4 year schedule for ge courses
Subject: The long awaited digest of our discussions here
Subject: Re: The long awaited digest of our discussions here
Subject: Re: The long awaited digest of our discussions here
Subject: Re: The long awaited digest of our discussions here
Subject: 4-year Schedule & Upper Division GE
Subject: Re: 4-year Schedule & Upper Division GE
Subject: Re: 4-year Schedule & Upper Division GE
Subject: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow
Subject: Required Yearly courses voted Tomorrow?
Subject: Re: Required Yearly courses voted Tomorrow?
Subject: ge requirement for pe
Subject: Re: ge requirement for pe
Subject: Re: ge requirement for pe
Subject: GE PE requirement
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow
Subject: Decisions
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow
Subject: Service (was "Decisions")
Subject: Re: GE PE requirement
Subject: Re: Decisions
Subject: A Question and a Comment
Subject: Re: A Question and a Comment
Subject: Re: A Question and a Comment
Subject: Re: A Question and a Comment
Subject: Re: A Question and a Comment
Subject: Re: A Question and a Comment
Subject: none
Subject: Re: A Question and a Comment
Subject: An Explanation about Communication
Subject: GE 3 credit Health Requirement
Subject: Re: GE 3 credit Health Requirement
Subject: More comment
Subject: Proposal Support
Subject: Re: More comment
Subject: Re: More comment
Subject: The Continuing Structure of GE--Re McBride
Subject: Re: More comment
Subject: Re: The Continuing Structure of GE--Re McBride
Subject: Survey Results & Meeting
Subject: Change the Composition of the Board?
Subject: Re: Change the Composition of the Board?
Subject: Re: Change the Composition of the Board?
Subject: Re: Change the Composition of the Board?
Subject: Re: Change the Composition of the Board?
Subject: Re: Change the Composition of the Board?
Subject: Re: Change the Composition of the Board?
Subject: Re: Change the Composition of the Board?
Subject: Constitutional Proposals for the Constituency
Subject: Re: Constitutional Proposals for the Constituency
Subject: Grad Schools of Education Reputational Rankings: 1996 (US News & (fwd)
Subject: CALL FOR PROPOSALS (fwd)
Subject: Any Volunteers for an Assessment Subcommittee
Subject: Re: Any Volunteers for an Assessment Subcommittee
Subject: Re: [Req #1257] Web Page on Andrews Listing for students
Subject: US Government Involvement in GE
Subject: RE: US Government Involvement in GE
Subject: Re: US Government Involvement in GE
Subject: What Adventism is GE to teach?
Subject: Re: What Adventism is GE to teach?
Subject: Petitioning Science Areas
Subject: Re: Petitioning Science Areas
Subject: RE: Petitioning Science Areas
Subject: RE: Petitioning Science Areas
Subject: SERVICE FOR TRANSFER STUDENTS
Subject: none
Subject: UPDATE: GE for Transfer Students
Subject: Clarification of Religion Options
Subject: Invitation to join GE Subcommittees
Subject: none
Subject: Attracting Bad Luck
Subject: Re: Invitation to join GE Subcommittees
Subject: Re: Invitation to join GE Subcommittees
Subject: Folkenberg Calls for Total Individual Committment to God
Subject: You might enjoy this... Training vs. Education
Subject: Disk Usage
Subject: Undergraduate Policies: Admission
Subject: Re: Undergraduate Policies: Admission
Subject: Re: Undergraduate Policies: Admission
Subject: Pitzer on Steinberg, _Beyond the Classroom_ (fwd)
Subject: mailing list changes
Subject: RE: mailing list changes
Subject: M-ge: Re: mailing list changes
Subject: Disk Usage
Subject: List of Net Sources for Term Papers
Subject: RE: List of Net Sources for Term Papers
Subject: Drucker's views on the survivability of Universities (fwd)
Subject: Re: Drucker's views on the survivability of Universities (fwd)
Subject: Re: Drucker's views on the survivability of Universities (fwd)
Subject: Re: Drucker's views on the survivability of Universities (fwd)
Subject: Re: Drucker's views on the survivability of Universities (fwd)
Subject: Drucker et al.
Subject: Correction
Subject: M-ge: subscribe
Subject: none
Subject: subscirbe
Subject: subscirbe
Subject: Discussion Question for GE
Subject: RE: Discussion Question for GE
Subject: Re: Association for General and Liberal Studies
Subject: Who You Are Makes a Difference
Subject: Certified by: (KeyID: F72ED579)
Subject: M-ge: RE: DISCOUNT SOFTWARE
Subject: M-ge: RE: DISCOUNT SOFTWARE
Subject: ITS Communication
Subject: RE: ITS Communication
Subject: Pager Numbers
Subject: Pager #s
Subject: Integrating Windows NT Server 4.0 with NetWare, Unix, and IBM Operating
Subject: M-connexions99: CONNEXIONS99: What if
Subject: Spring Quarter Class Lists in WebCT
Subject: Nextel # and ID
Subject: WebCT Course July 5-9
Subject: Nextel phone problems
Subject: [Fwd: academy]
Subject: Re: WebCT


Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 12:07:08 -0400 (EDT)
From: Patricia Scott 
Subject: Re: Changing Religion Requirements

Malcolm, I would certainly favor team teaching for religion/health 
sciences or humanities, but will discuss with members of the department.  
Dr, McBride and I briefly talked about a capstone course with input from 
both of our departments and religion--could be a very exciting course 
dealing with some of the thornier issues such as abortion, "pulling the 
plug", transplants for substance abusers, etc.  Thanks for opening this 
forum so we can all get our penny's worth into the discussion!

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Students Holding Up
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 06:02:59 -0400 (EDT)

Here's something we sometimes don't like to think about--but perhaps
somebody should.

One fact of campus life is that some courses are considered lighter than
others, and experienced academic advisors often seek to balance off the
very challenging or time consuming (e.g., freshman calculus) with
something else (which you'll not catch me mentioning).

If, in fact, we reform those "something else" classes to make them more
challenging and take more time, what will become of the bit of
relaxation they provided students?

Is anybody at Andrews considering the broader aspects of student
academic and non-academic life?
	Malcolm

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Freshman Classes--please suggest
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 06:27:25 -0400 (EDT)

re: Freshman Program

Pending a determination of what the GE requirements will actually be,
the GE committee has not established any sort of required or recommended
Freshman Experience. However, schools with such requirements probably
retain more of their students. There are other benefits to setting a
group of courses that freshmen would take, and we can discuss them if
you wish.

For starters, here are a couple of alternatives that you might react to:

I. staggered courses:

Fall: 
	3 credits COMM104 or ENGL111
	4 credits Bible Core or Intro to Social Sciences
	4 credits in major
	4 credits elective/cognates/ge.
Winter:
	Continue with ENGL or COMM
	alternate the Bible/Social Sciences
Spring:
	
II. 2-credit social science approach
Fall:
	4 credits Bible Core
	2 credits Intro to Social Sciences
	3 credits COMM or ENGL composition
	remainder: in major, electives, or Wellness, etc.

This option permits a fairly simple approach to 13 credits by adding one
more 4-credit class, to 14 credits with a 5-credit class or combination,
or 15 credits if computers were taken with a 4-credit course. 16 becomes
more difficult, but not in every area. Business students, for example,
could take Accounting (3 cr.) + 4 math or other GE. Others might use the
wellness class.


What becomes quite difficult in this scenario is the ambitious freshman
who wants to take 2 of any of the following year-long sequences:
G Chem, Foundations of Biology, Physics, Freshman Calculus.

Any comments?
Anything else we should add?
Presumably a minimum required plus recommended program would simplify
things a little.

From: pichot@andrews.edu (Kimberly Pichot)
Subject: Re: Freshman Classes--please suggest
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 10:08:47 -0400 (EDT)

> re: Freshman Program
> 
> Pending a determination of what the GE requirements will actually be,
> the GE committee has not established any sort of required or recommended
> Freshman Experience. However, schools with such requirements probably
> retain more of their students. There are other benefits to setting a
> group of courses that freshmen would take, and we can discuss them if
> you wish.
 ARE WE GOING TO ELIMINATE THE FRESHMAN EXPERIENCE ALL TOGETHER?
 
 I THINK THAT A ONE OR .5 CREDIT COLLOQUIUM (sp?) FOR STUDENTS EACH YEAR
 WHERE THEY ARE REQUIRED TO ATTEND CERTAIN AMOUNT OF
 ASSEMBLIES/DEPARTMENTAL MEETINGS SPECIFIC TO THEIR MAJOR WOULD BE A
 GREAT ADDITION.  THIS COULD SUBSTITUTE FOR THE FRESHMAN EXPERIENCE, AND
 GIVE US CONTINUAL CONTACT WITH OUR STUDENTS.  ALSO COULD BE USED TO
 GIVE THEM EXPOSURE TO GUEST SPEAKERS, CAREER DEVELOPMENT IN THEIR
 FIELD, ETC.
 





> 

> 




































Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 11:54:17 -0400 (EDT)
From: William Richardson 
Subject: none

I appreciate Malcolm's concern that we will become so efficient in our 
designing of new courses that the students will have no breathing space 
at all. My guess, however, is that such a development is not terribly 
worrisome. I doubt if we will ever get that uniform in our building of 
new courses that every milligram of fat will be removed. Still I am glad 
to see that human concern expressed in the midst of such cerebral 
discussions. 

Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 14:10:03 -0400 (EDT)
From: Alice Williams 
Subject: Re: general education

Re health class and Malcolm's request, 
the Nutrition department is very interested in having formal input into a 
health class.  Part of the "SDA imprint" must be graduates who believe 
that they can choose to improve their health status and prevent or delay 
disease onset.  Such a class needs to be practical and useful, leading 
students beyond the basic information they may have heard throughout their 
elementary and secondary education experiences.

I am concerned about transfer students when we discuss a "Freshman Year" 
concept.  Improving retention is a worthy and necessary goal, but we 
cannot forget the effect of any GE requirements on the transfer student.  
If we make transfering too onerous, those students will seek other schools 
for completing professional programs or for obtaining the quality education 
in other fields we can best provide.  A Freshman Experience concept has 
merit.  However, the transfer student should be welcome and integrated 
into the program without feeling "different" because s/he did not have 
the same initial experience.  I would like to see broad-based discussion
of a freshman experience that included more than academic programming.  
We are trying to facilitate several areas of development--social, 
spiritual, emotional--in addition to the mental development.  An 
integrated approach that acknowledges the diversity of our new students 
would be beneficial.

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Freshman Ed. and Transfer Students
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 14:57:00 -0400 (EDT)

Alice, there's no doubt that the Nutrition department must play a major
role in designing and continuing the health class. My one question would
be who from the department?

Second, the freshman year concept, as I proposed it this morning, would
involve only about 8 credits per quarter of required courses, leaving
the other half of a full load as the student selects and advisor sees
fit. 

With any program at Andrews we walk a fine line between making the
freshman year so much a part of student life that transfer students feel
"left out," and having a freshman year (like the present?) that involves
so little of note that there's not much reason to come here for it
rather than somewhere else--or even to stay.

Alice is right again on the need to address more than just the academic
aspects of the freshman year, and we've asked for a committee to be
established for that purpose.
> 
> Re health class and Malcolm's request, 
> the Nutrition department is very interested in having formal input into a 
> health class.  Part of the "SDA imprint" must be graduates who believe 
> that they can choose to improve their health status and prevent or delay 
> disease onset.  Such a class needs to be practical and useful, leading 
> students beyond the basic information they may have heard throughout their 
> elementary and secondary education experiences.
> 
> I am concerned about transfer students when we discuss a "Freshman Year" 
> concept.  Improving retention is a worthy and necessary goal, but we 
> cannot forget the effect of any GE requirements on the transfer student.  
> If we make transfering too onerous, those students will seek other schools 
> for completing professional programs or for obtaining the quality education 
> in other fields we can best provide.  A Freshman Experience concept has 
> merit.  However, the transfer student should be welcome and integrated 
> into the program without feeling "different" because s/he did not have 
> the same initial experience.  I would like to see broad-based discussion
> of a freshman experience that included more than academic programming.  
> We are trying to facilitate several areas of development--social, 
> spiritual, emotional--in addition to the mental development.  An 
> integrated approach that acknowledges the diversity of our new students 
> would be beneficial.
> 

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: How is this for a Freshman Year?
Date: Mon, 23 Oct 1995 18:05:57 -0400 (EDT)

Colleges and universities with formal freshman programs think that they
help improve student performance and retention. Two alternative methods
are a cluster of freshman courses, or the freshman seminar route.

Subject: none

Fall Quarter: Religion (4) plus Composition/Communication (3)
Winter: Math (4) plus Composition/Communication (3)
Spring: Service (2) plus Health/Wellness (3) plus Comp/COMM (3)

These 22 credits would be required, and faculty involved in teaching
them could have a particular responsibility for the goals Andrews
establishes for its freshmen. 

The remaining work could be courses in the major, further GE, or
electives. A few sections of service and health/wellness could be
offered other quarters, to facilitate faculty time.

This might facilitate scheduling, too, if the required courses were
offered at specific times (e.g., 9:30 and 10:30), thus reducing
conflicts with other classes. 

Can we, and should we, attempt something like this?
	Malcolm

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 08:04:58 -0400
From: mcbride@andrews.edu (Duane C. McBride)
Subject: Re: How is this for a Freshman Year?

OK, but how does that relate to the 8 hours of social science?

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 08:08:19 -0400
From: mcbride@andrews.edu (Duane C. McBride)
Subject: Re: How is this for a Freshman Year?

Given the schedule you outlined when would they take the social science
hours, there sophomore year.  which would be ok.

From: paden@andrews.edu (Ray Paden)
Subject: Re: How is this for a Freshman Year?
Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 09:58:53 -0400 (EDT)

Hi,

   Overall the freshman schedule looks good, but the natural science class
   is planning on using the 8 credits of math and 4 credits of computing 
   as a prerequisite.  This would imply that students would be likely to 
   complete the math and computing in sophmore year putting natural science
   off to the Junior year.  Thats OK, but it is a ramification that should
   be considered.

   Also, I would strongly urge that the computing requirement be put in the
   freshman year for a similar reason we put composition in the freshman year.  
   It is intended to provide them with valuable knowledge and skills that 
   can be used throughout their college experience as well as after
   graduation.  

Regards,
Ray
> 
> Colleges and universities with formal freshman programs think that they
> help improve student performance and retention. Two alternative methods
> are a cluster of freshman courses, or the freshman seminar route.
> 
> From your various perspectives as advisors and professors, what would
> you have to a required program for all freshmen that looked like this:
> 
> Fall Quarter: Religion (4) plus Composition/Communication (3)
> Winter: Math (4) plus Composition/Communication (3)
> Spring: Service (2) plus Health/Wellness (3) plus Comp/COMM (3)
> 
> These 22 credits would be required, and faculty involved in teaching
> them could have a particular responsibility for the goals Andrews
> establishes for its freshmen. 
> 
> The remaining work could be courses in the major, further GE, or
> electives. A few sections of service and health/wellness could be
> offered other quarters, to facilitate faculty time.
> 
> This might facilitate scheduling, too, if the required courses were
> offered at specific times (e.g., 9:30 and 10:30), thus reducing
> conflicts with other classes. 
> 
> Can we, and should we, attempt something like this?
> 	Malcolm
> 


-- 
 -----------------------------------------------------------------
| paden@andrews.edu     |  "Of making many books there is no end, |
| Raymond L. Paden      |  and much study wearies the body."      |
| Chair, CSIS Dept.     |                 -- Eccl. 12:12          |
| Andrews University     -----------------------------------------|
| Berrien Springs, MI 49104-0360                                  |
| (616) 471-3214                                                  |
 -----------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Daniel E. Turk" 
Subject: Re: How is this for a Freshman Year?
Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 10:04:30 -0500 (EDT)

I would strongly second Ray's urge to put Computing in the Freshman
year.  It needs to be there and used by many classes which follow it.
My feeling is that we should expect it to be taken early, and then later
classes should expect it as a prerequisite.  It is a valuable tool that
we should be making strong use of.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dan Turk                  turk@acm.org                       Ph.D. Student
(770) 984-2359          dan.turk@gsu.edu           CIS Dept, Georgia State
==========================================================================

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Computing, History and Social Science as Freshmen
Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 11:18:05 -0400 (EDT)

Ray noticed that the minimum requirements sketched yesterday for the
freshman year a). did not include computer science, and b). included
only 4 credits of math.

He's entirely correct. The 22 credits enable students to take roughly
half their courses in the major, cognates, or electives. Is that about
right?

Undoubtedly the computer science, history/philosophy, and some social
science courses ought to be recommended for the first year. Do they need
to be required, especially since word processing will not form part of
the computing requirement?
	Malcolm

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 11:33:16 -0400 (EDT)
From: Neville Webster 
Subject: Re: Computing, History and Social Science as Freshmen

Just to add my support for having computer science added to the list of 
freshman subjects.  Even on the assumption that freshman have already 
been exposed to word processing, there are other skills that computer 
science can contribute that would be very useful to the student's future 
academic life.

Neville Webster

From: "Daniel E. Turk" 
Subject: Re: Computing, History and Social Science as Freshmen
Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 11:46:29 -0500 (EDT)

> Undoubtedly the computer science, history/philosophy, and some social
> science courses ought to be recommended for the first year. Do they need
> to be required, especially since word processing will not form part of
> the computing requirement?

I think computing should be required in the first year...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dan Turk                  turk@acm.org                       Ph.D. Student
(770) 984-2359          dan.turk@gsu.edu           CIS Dept, Georgia State
==========================================================================

From: "Richard D. Show" 
Date: Tue, 24 Oct 95 13:55:40 EST
Subject: Re: Computing in Freshman Year

I agree computer skills should be acquired as early as possible. However, 
what skills will be taught? Could the course be flexible to allow for 
skills the student has mastered? For example, if the student knew 
word processing then he should be able to focus on spreadsheets or data 
bases and/or statistical applications etc.

From: paden@andrews.edu (Ray Paden)
Subject: Re: Computing in Freshman Year
Date: Tue, 24 Oct 1995 14:43:40 -0400 (EDT)

Hi,
> 
> I agree computer skills should be acquired as early as possible. However, 
> what skills will be taught? Could the course be flexible to allow for 
> skills the student has mastered? For example, if the student knew 
> word processing then he should be able to focus on spreadsheets or data 
> bases and/or statistical applications etc.
> 
ANS:  Currently, most high schools and academies teach at least of semester of
      computing to its students.  Therefore, word processing is a prerequisite
      to the new course.  More emphasis will be given to things like
      email, spreadsheets, database, web and internet, multimedia, presentation
      graphics and the like.  Also some fundamental knowledge about the 
      components of computer and problem solving skills using a computer.

      For students who have not had word processing, there will be a 2 credit
      remedial course taught, similar in concept to the present MATH 105, 106.

      It may be possible to have different sections which emphasize different
      applications.

Regards,
Ray


-- 
 -----------------------------------------------------------------
| paden@andrews.edu     |  "Of making many books there is no end, |
| Raymond L. Paden      |  and much study wearies the body."      |
| Chair, CSIS Dept.     |                 -- Eccl. 12:12          |
| Andrews University     -----------------------------------------|
| Berrien Springs, MI 49104-0360                                  |
| (616) 471-3214                                                  |
 -----------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Oct 95 14:47:37 EST
From: "" 
Subject: Re: How is this for a Freshman Year?

Malcolm--

I agree that a freshman year core of required subjects can begin to 
compensate for the lack of a freshman seminar.  I believe, however, that we 
need to try to have some of the core courses deal with certain freshman 
issues in the first quarter.  Which of the areas will be willing to do so?  

We in the humanities have (in our latest compromise) tentatively put the 
civilizations and ideas course in the freshman year.  Are you suggesting 
that this course could be either the freshman or sophomore year?  We have 
thought of the arts and literature course as a sophomore course.  I am not 
certain that we can manage all the various courses in the sciences, social 
sciences, and humanities in the sophomore year.  Do we really want the 
science course to be taught for juniors?  I would think that the breadth 
requirement would best be handled at the junior and senior levels.

Delmer

Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 08:21:22 -0400
From: mutchp@andrews.edu (Patricia Mutch)
Subject: 

Responding to the recent "flurry" on the Freshman year...

It appears to me that the purpose of a "freshman experience" year is more 
than putting everyone through a common sequence of courses.  It involves 
also providing them with basic tools for the rest of their college work.  So 
the computer requirement and the social science "intro" course would be 
valuable in the first year.  There are a number of schools, I believe, in 
which the student has few, if any, courses in the major until the 2nd year.  
Leaving room for one course in the major per term might be sufficient for us.  

I also think we need to assure, somehow, that students get the assistance 
they need in adapting to the college environment successfully; what has been 
provided under the Freshman Seminar in the past.  I've had two encounters 
with students in the past 48 hours, both freshman and both good students -- 
teetering on the edge of dropping out because of adaptation problems.  We 
need to find some way for that to be averted for a higher proportion of our 
1st year students. 
Patricia Mutch, Ph.D.
Dean, College of Arts & Sciences
Andrews University
tel 616-471-3411; fax 616-471-6236

Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 08:51:12 -0400 (EDT)
From: Alice Williams 
Subject: Re: How is this for a Freshman Year?

I agree with flurry of messages re freshman year.  Many programs rely on 
a base of social science, computer, math, and communications skills.  
Thus a freshman year that allows one course per term for the major field 
or cognates for the major field seems about right.

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Freshman Experience is more than Courses
Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 11:18:37 -0400 (EDT)

In response to Dean Mutch's comments:
> 
> Responding to the recent "flurry" on the Freshman year...
> 
> It appears to me that the purpose of a "freshman experience" year is more 
> than putting everyone through a common sequence of courses.  It involves 
> also providing them with basic tools for the rest of their college work.
	Absolutely. But there are many ways of providing those basic
	tools, and we need to discover which way--or ways--work best at
	AU. Right now nothing seems to be done.

So 
> the computer requirement and the social science "intro" course would be 
> valuable in the first year.  There are a number of schools, I believe, in 
> which the student has few, if any, courses in the major until the 2nd year.  
> Leaving room for one course in the major per term might be sufficient for us.  
	I keep hearing of freshmen who must take calculus and a science.
	Those are 3-quarter courses, and together total at least 24
	credits for the year. Are the science faculty, the technology
	faculty and others willing to redesign their curricula to have
	less than the credits symbolized by these examples?  (Please
	ignore the GE implications--Foundations of Biology and Calculus
	are not the sort of courses where the basic tools get learned)
	
	> 
> I also think we need to assure, somehow, that students get the assistance 
> they need in adapting to the college environment successfully; what has been 
> provided under the Freshman Seminar in the past.
	
	The members of the GE committee probably would appreciate
	faculty responses as to the effectiveness of Freshman Seminar.
	One hears a variety of opinions.

	Again, though, the useful content of Freshman Seminar need not
	form a separate class, but could be incorporated into a cluster
	of courses that all freshmen would be required to take.

I've had two encounters 
> with students in the past 48 hours, both freshman and both good students -- 
> teetering on the edge of dropping out because of adaptation problems.  We 
> need to find some way for that to be averted for a higher proportion of our 
> 1st year students. 
	Undoubtedly.
	I was chagrined to learn that our retention rate for freshmen is
	below that of Edinburg State (in Pennsylvania). In fact, it
	seems below that of their marginal students.
		Malcolm

> Patricia Mutch, Ph.D.
> Dean, College of Arts & Sciences
> Andrews University
> tel 616-471-3411; fax 616-471-6236
> 
> 

Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 14:20:48 -0400 (EDT)
From: Georgina Hill 
Subject: none

One more vote for including the computer courses in the freshman year.  
We regularly have students in freshman composition who are using 
typewriters for their compositions--and feeling technologically 
advanced!  Making sure that all the freshman are at least acquainted with 
computers would assist the freshman composition courses.

From: "" 
Date: Wed, 25 Oct 95 14:22:24 EST
Subject: Re: Freshman Experience is more than Courses

This is a reply to Maocolms missive:

With respect to the sciences, I can only speak to Chemistry, but for 
chemistry majors, not taking Freshman Calculus and General Chemistry their 
Freshman year, means five years to the diploma, unless they find an 
acceptable place to take one of these during the summer.

Freshman Calculus is required for Physics for Scientists and Engineers 
(sophomore year) which is required for Physical Chemistry (Junior year) 
which is required for Quantum Chemistry (Senior year).

Occasionaly, a student will get out of the sequence, forcing themselves to 
take Physical Chemistry and Quantum Chemistry simultaneously.  They rue the 
decision or circumstances that led to that situation!!!

For science majors, classes such as Calculus are basics!!  Anything lower 
is remedial.

As for retention rate, although there may be exceptions, to my knowledge 
most of the schools with high retention rates are also commensurately 
selective in their admissions.  Considering the cost of an education at 
Andrews, I think we could be somewhat more selective as well.  Many of the 
schools that at one time operated extensive remedial programs have dropped 
them because they were found to not be cost effective.  In Chemistry, we 
dropped the Chemical Calculations course, because too few of the students 
who needed it were successful after taking the course, so we decided that 
the outcome would not change by dropping the course.  We now recommend some 
of the remedial courses taught by the Math Dept.  I don't think we can or 
should be teaching high school level courses at Andrews for University 
level students.  They should be required for admission.

Cheers.
*********************************************************************
* G. William Mutch                Phone: (616)471-3248 (voice mail) *
* Department of Chemistry                       Fax:  (616)471-6396 * 
* Andrews University                      E-Mail: mutch@andrews.edu *
* Berrien Springs, MI  49104-0430                                   *
*********************************************************************

Date: Wed, 25 Oct 1995 17:35:04 -0400 (EDT)
From: Neville Webster 
Subject: Re: Freshman Year Experience



On Wed, 25 Oct 1995, Bill Mutch wrote:

> I favor a Freshman Year program that allows key majors/cognate courses to 
> be taken along with ge courses.  This will get most of the ge done in thw 
> first two years instead of spreading it out until almost graduation to get 
> it done.
> 

Subject: none

Neville Webster

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: A 4-Year Schedule
Date: Tue, 31 Oct 1995 21:41:16 +1900 (EST)

After meeting with the Education faculty on Monday morning, I wonder if
it would be possible to have all General Education options put on a
4-year schedule.

Apparently they have a very difficult time advising their students
because courses change time so often.

We'd need some sort of escape hatch, but it makes sense to commit
ourselves first to keeping a coherent GE schedule, because upper
division classes are smaller, and involve primarily majors and minors.
Therefore needs are fewer, and often alternatives simpler.

Is a 4-year GE schedule something we should work towards?
Would it help you in advising, and your students in planning?
Is it realistic given faculty turnover... etc.?

I'd appreciate your response.
	Malcolm

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Portfolio Topics
Date: Tue, 31 Oct 1995 21:46:07 +1900 (EST)

As you know, the GE committee recommends that students be expected to
establish a personal portfolio, with a number of entries that reflect
the quality of educational accomplishments here, s and abilities for the
job market, and departmental suggestions.

For a starting list, I'd recommend the following. What should we add?
	Resume (begun freshman year; updated)
	Papers, evaluations from writing-intensive courses
	essays on personal health, fitness, etc. 
	a substantial essay presenting one's worldview
	an articulation of future aspirations and prospects
	
	+ items from the major.

	What do you think?
		Malcolm

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Philosophy of Service Course
Date: Tue, 31 Oct 1995 21:51:26 +1900 (EST)


Possibly needed: faculty to teach the philosophy of service course.

If the proposed Philosophy of Service course becomes a reality, faculty
members will be needed to teach the 2-credit course.

Initially we envision the course approaching service from the
perspective of Christian service as well as the civic responsibility of
leaders. A group of faculty members, possibly from many different
disciplines, could undertake to teach sections of the course, working
together at the start on rather common texts and themes, but allowing
some domain for individual perspectives.

Does this seem useful, as a preparation for the actual service that we
ought to inspire our students to do, given the AU mission statement?
	Malcolm

From: "Daniel E. Turk" 
Subject: Re: A 4-Year Schedule
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 06:09:14 -0500 (EST)

> Is a 4-year GE schedule something we should work towards?
> Would it help you in advising, and your students in planning?
> Is it realistic given faculty turnover... etc.?

Yes, I think that a 4-year schedule could be useful, and possibly
something we should work toward.  However, this raises an issue that's
been coming back to me over and over during the whole time we've been
discussing course offerings and loads, and requirements for students.
Namely, trying to be extremely flexible in what students can take, but
fitting within our limitations as far as being a smaller private
University with limited resources.

Basically here's what I'm perceiving.  It seems that we want to be able
to give students options - so that they don't have to take certain
classes during given quarters or years of study and at certain times of
the day.  However, it seems that we are trying to reduce the options
available because of the need to streamline what is offered and so that
we can have smaller teaching loads, etc.  It seems to me that what we
have to realize is that we either are extremely flexible in what we let
the students do, OR we require the STUDENTS to be responsible and to
take classes at given times and to fit classes into a schedule the way
they are offered.  I think that we should be sensitive to students
predicaments, their backgrounds coming into our programs, etc., but
ultimately I think that we need to offer courses in ways that are
economically supportable and in ways that make teaching loads more
reasonable and expect that students will need to be responsible and take
classes when they are offered.  This is what is done at other schools,
and (surprise, surprise) students take the responsibility and fit their
schedules to the course offerings.  :)  I hope that we can find some way
to merge the needs of senisitivity to students, economic and teacher
load parameters, and putting responsibility on students to take classes
in sequences and at times that they are offered so that they have
prerequisites done when they are needed and so that they can finish a
degree in a time-period that is reasonable.

Well, those are my thoughts, for what they're worth!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dan Turk                  turk@acm.org                       Ph.D. Student
(770) 984-2359          dan.turk@gsu.edu           CIS Dept, Georgia State
==========================================================================

From: "Daniel E. Turk" 
Subject: Re: Portfolio Topics
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 06:18:43 -0500 (EST)

Malcolm wrote about student portfolios in a recent note:

> As you know, the GE committee recommends that students be expected to
> establish a personal portfolio, with a number of entries that reflect
> the quality of educational accomplishments here, s and abilities for the
> job market, and departmental suggestions.

My main issue here is that I hope this is not the beginning of what I've
been seeing and hearing about at the elementary and highschool level of
students being given grades based on their "portfolio" as opposed to how
they do in a class on each assignment during a given academic term.
Unless we choose to change to a more "British" system of evaluation
where testing is done at the end of the several-year educational process
I think that using "portfolios" to base academic grading upon is not the
way we should be proceeding.  (I do not think that this perspective is
what is meant by the use of the term "portfolio" in what Malcolm
suggests above, but just want to make sure that it isn't!)  I see too many 
trends coming and going in elementary and secondary education that are
getting pushed and that don't really seem to get at the issues that I 
see as important for developing well educated graduates.

So, with that caveat I can comment on the following list:

> 
> For a starting list, I'd recommend the following. What should we add?
> 	Resume (begun freshman year; updated)
> 	Papers, evaluations from writing-intensive courses
> 	essays on personal health, fitness, etc. 
> 	a substantial essay presenting one's worldview
> 	an articulation of future aspirations and prospects
> 	
> 	+ items from the major.
> 
> 	What do you think?
> 		Malcolm

Yes, it would certainly be good for students to keep a collection
("portfolio") of these things available and to update resume's, etc.
over time.  For students in the computing degrees it would be useful for
them to keep specific projects that they have done (analysis, design,
applications, etc.) so that they could show samples of their work as
needed.  I certainly think that urging students to create and maintain a
collection like this would be useful to them.  In fact, it might just
get them used to recording and maintaining the information which is
necessary for all of us to continually keep our resumes and CV's
current...!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dan Turk                  turk@acm.org                       Ph.D. Student
(770) 984-2359          dan.turk@gsu.edu           CIS Dept, Georgia State
==========================================================================

From: "Daniel E. Turk" 
Subject: Re: Philosophy of Service Course
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 06:24:49 -0500 (EST)

I'm wondering a little about the rationale behind the Philosophy of
Service course that is being discussed.

Given the direction that I'm perceiving for moving some of the general
courses (like application of religious and ethical values within the
major, etc.) to be taught within each student's major, I'm wondering why
we are suggesting having a new course of this type.  Is this not
something that could be integrated into classes within each major as
well?  

I think that formally addressing issues such as this in a class
is a good idea; I'm just trying to understand the reason for adding a
new course like this when we are attempting to streamline the course
offerings that we currently have...  Any explanations and rationale that
anyone can share would be appreciated.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dan Turk                  turk@acm.org                       Ph.D. Student
(770) 984-2359          dan.turk@gsu.edu           CIS Dept, Georgia State
==========================================================================

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Why require Philosophy of Service
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 06:48:50 -0500 (EST)

Even earlier this morning Dan Turk asked the question
	"Why require a philosophy of service course?"
It deserves an answer.

There are many possible rationales, not excluding the fact that on
politically correct campuses, service is increasingly required. However,
at Andrews, we have a mission statement that pledges the institution to
promote service.

Sermons and chapels won't accomplish it, or we'd see the evidence now.
Only some will respond.

We could attempt to incorporate service into specific classes, in the
major. This is what we plan to do for the actual field work. 

However, incoming students already show a certain resistance to service.
They don't wish to volunteer in large numbers for service opportunities
during college days. They often begrudge service as unpaid required
labor.

A philosophy of service course would establish that leadership, civic
responsibility, and Christianity all imply service to others. The
market, and paid employment is not sufficient.

Does this make sense?
	Malcolm

From: "Daniel E. Turk" 
Subject: Re: Why require Philosophy of Service
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 07:56:21 -0500 (EST)

> Even earlier this morning Dan Turk asked the question
> 	"Why require a philosophy of service course?"
> It deserves an answer.

The answer provide makes very good sense.  In fact, I agree with all
of the rationale and with the purpose of having the class.  My question,
I guess, really was focusing on why we want a specific class for this, rather
than integrating the content into other classes across the curriculum.
Would it be possible to accomplish the same thing that way, or will it
be more effective to have a specific class?  What are the pros and cons
of each method?  For instance, having a specific class provides more
focus and identity to the topic; having the content integrated across
other courses makes it more a "part of the curriculum" and possibly
brings the student to make service more a part of his/her life
throughout the college experience...  There are probably other pros/cons
as well.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dan Turk                  turk@acm.org                       Ph.D. Student
(770) 984-2359          dan.turk@gsu.edu           CIS Dept, Georgia State
==========================================================================

Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 08:06:18 -0500
From: mutchp@andrews.edu (Patricia Mutch)
Subject: Re: A 4-Year Schedule

Reply to proposal below:  
I think a consistent time/quarter schedule for GE would benefit many people 
including CAS advisors.  It's a goal to work towards -- how consistent will 
be determined by how many other changes departments or schools need to make. 
 e.g. space fluctuations (Nethery may have a number of "disrupted" 
classrooms over the next several years); efficiency changes, etc.


>After meeting with the Education faculty on Monday morning, I wonder if
>it would be possible to have all General Education options put on a
>4-year schedule.
>
>Apparently they have a very difficult time advising their students
>because courses change time so often.
>
>We'd need some sort of escape hatch, but it makes sense to commit
>ourselves first to keeping a coherent GE schedule, because upper
>division classes are smaller, and involve primarily majors and minors.
>Therefore needs are fewer, and often alternatives simpler.
>
>Is a 4-year GE schedule something we should work towards?
>Would it help you in advising, and your students in planning?
>Is it realistic given faculty turnover... etc.?
>
>I'd appreciate your response.
>	Malcolm
>
>
Patricia Mutch, Ph.D.
Dean, College of Arts & Sciences
Andrews University
tel 616-471-3411; fax 616-471-6236

From: "Daniel E. Turk" 
Subject: Re: Why require Philosophy of Service
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 07:56:21 -0500 (EST)

> Even earlier this morning Dan Turk asked the question
> 	"Why require a philosophy of service course?"
> It deserves an answer.

The answer provide makes very good sense.  In fact, I agree with all
of the rationale and with the purpose of having the class.  My question,
I guess, really was focusing on why we want a specific class for this, rather
than integrating the content into other classes across the curriculum.
Would it be possible to accomplish the same thing that way, or will it
be more effective to have a specific class?  What are the pros and cons
of each method?  For instance, having a specific class provides more
focus and identity to the topic; having the content integrated across
other courses makes it more a "part of the curriculum" and possibly
brings the student to make service more a part of his/her life
throughout the college experience...  There are probably other pros/cons
as well.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dan Turk                  turk@acm.org                       Ph.D. Student
(770) 984-2359          dan.turk@gsu.edu           CIS Dept, Georgia State
==========================================================================

Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 08:06:18 -0500
From: mutchp@andrews.edu (Patricia Mutch)
Subject: Re: A 4-Year Schedule

Reply to proposal below:  
I think a consistent time/quarter schedule for GE would benefit many people 
including CAS advisors.  It's a goal to work towards -- how consistent will 
be determined by how many other changes departments or schools need to make. 
 e.g. space fluctuations (Nethery may have a number of "disrupted" 
classrooms over the next several years); efficiency changes, etc.


>After meeting with the Education faculty on Monday morning, I wonder if
>it would be possible to have all General Education options put on a
>4-year schedule.
>
>Apparently they have a very difficult time advising their students
>because courses change time so often.
>
>We'd need some sort of escape hatch, but it makes sense to commit
>ourselves first to keeping a coherent GE schedule, because upper
>division classes are smaller, and involve primarily majors and minors.
>Therefore needs are fewer, and often alternatives simpler.
>
>Is a 4-year GE schedule something we should work towards?
>Would it help you in advising, and your students in planning?
>Is it realistic given faculty turnover... etc.?
>
>I'd appreciate your response.
>	Malcolm
>
>
Patricia Mutch, Ph.D.
Dean, College of Arts & Sciences
Andrews University
tel 616-471-3411; fax 616-471-6236

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Re: Why a separate Philosophy Class II
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 11:06:01 -0500 (EST)

The GE committee members favored a separate class to develop the
philosophical basis of service because we felt
	1). The topic is too large to add to most existing courses. How
	many of us would willingly give up even 10 lectures and related
	homework to the issue.

	2). It needed a coherent group's attention. If all the service
	is incorporated into other classes, it will go the way of the
	work ethic: sought in order to increase enrollments, but too
	often covered in a perfuncturary way.

	3). A class like this at the freshman year would help students
	discover consciously their values and world view, while
	preparing them for actual service later.
		Malcolm

Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 16:51:23 -0500 (EST)
From: Neville Webster 
Subject: Re: Portfolio Topics



On Tue, 31 Oct 1995, Malcolm Russell wrote:

> As you know, the GE committee recommends that students be expected to
> establish a personal portfolio, with a number of entries that reflect
> the quality of educational accomplishments here, s and abilities for the
> job market, and departmental suggestions.
> 
> For a starting list, I'd recommend the following. What should we add?
> 	Resume (begun freshman year; updated)
> 	Papers, evaluations from writing-intensive courses
> 	essays on personal health, fitness, etc. 
> 	a substantial essay presenting one's worldview
> 	an articulation of future aspirations and prospects
> 	
> 	+ items from the major.
> 


A perspective from the business corner:

students in some of my classes produce a major business or marketing plan 
which should be an important part of this portfolio you speak of.  This 
becomes a valuable tool when interviewing for a job.

Neville Webster

Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 17:01:50 -0500 (EST)
From: Neville Webster 
Subject: Re: Why require Philosophy of Service

Further to Malcolm and Dan's comments on service classes:  

I think it would be valuable to have a specific class in the GE 
requirements that focussed specifically on the service aspect of our 
lives.  It would certainly support our mission.  However, as Dan hints 
at, let us not stop at that point.  The same sense of service should be 
cultivated and encouraged in as many other classes as possible, wherever 
appropriate and can be handled in a natural unstrained way.

But who is to teach the service class?  To keep the class from becoming a 
joke we need to include some of our best teachers in the teams.


Neville Webster

Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 17:17:37 -0500 (EST)
From: Neville Webster 
Subject: Re: A 4-Year Schedule



On Tue, 31 Oct 1995, Malcolm Russell wrote:

> 
> Is a 4-year GE schedule something we should work towards?
> Would it help you in advising, and your students in planning?
> Is it realistic given faculty turnover... etc.?
> 
> I'd appreciate your response.
> 	Malcolm
> 

A 4-year GE schedule makes sense to me.  Student choices will presumably 
not be an option because of the prescribed GE lineup.  Choices will only 
be possible in terms of the majors students choose and the general 
electives.  Therefore, map out their GE program for them so they know 
exactly what they should take, and when.  This could help avoid some 
clashes we face at present.  However, would the problem not come when 
trying to accommodate conflicting core class requirements from different 
schools?

Neville Webster
 

Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 17:36:30 -0500 (EST)
From: Patricia Scott 
Subject: 4 year schedule for ge courses

Although I favor the idea in principle, in practice it would be very 
difficult for our majors, for instance.  We are discussing, in private, 
the idea of going to an upper division major only, because of the 
difficulty of trying to schedule 8-hour nursing labs with other labs in 
cognates and ge courses.  Unlike many other courses, our nursing lab 
times are dictated by the hospital shift times and are totally out of our 
control.  We are already reduced to having some Sunday labs, detested by 
both students and teachers, and not very useful educationally because not 
much happens in hospitals on Sunday evenings except in acute care areas.

For these reasons, we would favor getting ge credits in the first two 
years unless teachers of ge credits were willing to have class in the 
evenings after students have already done hard physical labor for 8 
hours--which is the way we often now schedule our classes.  (I'm trying 
to change that.)

If the decision is to go to all four years for ge credits, the schedules 
must be arranged so that students who have 3 8-hour labs per week can 
still take them without having too unbearably long a day.

Thanks--this isn't going to be as easy as it sounded at first, is it!

From: bidwell@andrews.edu (Daniel R. Bidwell)
Subject: The long awaited digest of our discussions here
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 23:26:48 -0500 (EST)

I have created a web page to hold a digest of all of the discussion that
has gone on in this forum.  It is generated each morning from the
archives of the messages that have been posted.  It can be found from my
home page, "http://www.andrews.edu/~bidwell" or directly as
"http://www.andrews.edu/~bidwell/ge/ge.html".
-- 
Daniel R. Bidwell	|	bidwell@andrews.edu
Andrews University	Computer Science & Information Systems Department
If two always agree, one of them is unnecessary
"Friends don't let friends do DOS"
"In theory, theory and practice are the same.
In practice, however, they are not."

From: "Daniel E. Turk" 
Subject: Re: The long awaited digest of our discussions here
Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 05:54:02 -0500 (EST)

> I have created a web page to hold a digest of all of the discussion that
> has gone on in this forum.  It is generated each morning from the
> archives of the messages that have been posted.  It can be found from my
> home page, "http://www.andrews.edu/~bidwell" or directly as
> "http://www.andrews.edu/~bidwell/ge/ge.html".

Just a question.  Is the GE web page globally accessible?  I would think
that this type of thing should have access limited to AU faculty, and
not be available to everyone in the world...!  :)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dan Turk                  turk@acm.org                       Ph.D. Student
(770) 984-2359          dan.turk@gsu.edu           CIS Dept, Georgia State
==========================================================================

From: bidwell@andrews.edu (Daniel R. Bidwell)
Subject: Re: The long awaited digest of our discussions here
Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 08:59:19 -0500 (EST)

> 
> > I have created a web page to hold a digest of all of the discussion that
> > has gone on in this forum.  It is generated each morning from the
> > archives of the messages that have been posted.  It can be found from my
> > home page, "http://www.andrews.edu/~bidwell" or directly as
> > "http://www.andrews.edu/~bidwell/ge/ge.html".
> 
> Just a question.  Is the GE web page globally accessible?  I would think
> that this type of thing should have access limited to AU faculty, and
> not be available to everyone in the world...!  :)
> 
If that is what people want, I will restrict it to only on campus
viewing.

-- 
Daniel R. Bidwell	|	bidwell@andrews.edu
Andrews University	Computer Science & Information Systems Department
If two always agree, one of them is unnecessary
"Friends don't let friends do DOS"
"In theory, theory and practice are the same.
In practice, however, they are not."

Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 09:03:36 -0500 (EST)
From: Neville Webster 
Subject: Re: The long awaited digest of our discussions here



On Thu, 2 Nov 1995, Daniel R. Bidwell wrote:

> > 
> > > I have created a web page to hold a digest of all of the discussion that
> > > has gone on in this forum.  It is generated each morning from the
> > > archives of the messages that have been posted.  It can be found from my
> > > home page, "http://www.andrews.edu/~bidwell" or directly as
> > > "http://www.andrews.edu/~bidwell/ge/ge.html".
> > 
> > Just a question.  Is the GE web page globally accessible?  I would think
> > that this type of thing should have access limited to AU faculty, and
> > not be available to everyone in the world...!  :)
> > 
> If that is what people want, I will restrict it to only on campus
> viewing.
> 
> -- 
> Daniel R. Bidwell	|	bidwell@andrews.edu
> Andrews University	Computer Science & Information Systems Department
> If two always agree, one of them is unnecessary
> "Friends don't let friends do DOS"
> "In theory, theory and practice are the same.
> In practice, however, they are not."
> 


I think it would be wise to restrict access to campus users - plus Dan Turk 
of course!

Neville

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: 4-year Schedule & Upper Division GE
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 08:40:06 -0500 (EST)

Words and phrases carry different meanings across the campus, sometimes
causing confusion but also bringing important matters to our attention.

By the benefits of creating a 4-year schedule, the education faculty
meant a schedule of departmental GE offerings. Thus, for instance, we
would know what time GE options would be offered NEXT year, or even the
year after, while we plan this year's schedule.

Making such a committment limits departmental freedom. The question is,
do the benefits to us in advising outweigh the burdens?       

Patricia Scott raised the issue of GE stretching 
into the upper division years. With the program as
we conceived it last week (I've been gone....) the only upper division
courses would be in religion, and the core natural science. The former
is long-established, and we could presumably schedule sections for the
needs of nursing and other students with off-campus responsibilities.
The science courses could certainly be taken earlier by those who need
to do so--and anyway, programs like nursing will use the other science
requirements.
	Malcolm

Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 23:47:59 -0500 (EST)
From: Patricia Scott 
Subject: Re: 4-year Schedule & Upper Division GE

I think the benefits of having "fixed" ge classes would greatly outweigh 
the disadvantages PROVIDED the schedule fits in with outside commitments. 
Obviously if only the religion classes were left for our students, it 
would not be a problem, but at present even second year students have 
hospital labs; we would like to be consulted.  Not only are our labs 
limited by hospital schedules, but by the two community colleges who also 
use the hospitals for clinical experiences; we have "divided" the days, 
and this is not really negotiable any more.

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Re: 4-year Schedule & Upper Division GE
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 06:52:42 -0500 (EST)

Pat,

and anyone else so concerned:

Please send me your schedule. I'll preserve it for whomever takes over
GE next year. 

Thanks for pointing out the potential difficulties long enough ahead of
time to permit searching for reasonable solutions.
	Malcolm
	> 
> I think the benefits of having "fixed" ge classes would greatly outweigh 
> the disadvantages PROVIDED the schedule fits in with outside commitments. 
> Obviously if only the religion classes were left for our students, it 
> would not be a problem, but at present even second year students have 
> hospital labs; we would like to be consulted.  Not only are our labs 
> limited by hospital schedules, but by the two community colleges who also 
> use the hospitals for clinical experiences; we have "divided" the days, 
> and this is not really negotiable any more.
> 
> 

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 07:05:25 -0500 (EST)

Colleagues,

Tomorrow theGeneral Education committee is scheduled to vote on the
proposed new requirements for the BA and BS degrees.

Am I right in assuming that the proposed requirements and credits fall
into the following categories?                   

Essentially agreed and supported:
Religion      	16 cr including choice of a team-taught capstone course
Arts&Humanities	12 cr Divided into Ideas and History (3cr + 3 cr) and
			 Arts & Literature (3 cr + 3 cr).
Natural Science  8 cr Two laboratory-based core courses, or alternative
			 list for science majors, cognates, etc.
Social Science   8 cr Two of three interdisciplinary core courses OR
			discipline-based courses for majors, cognates,
                        etc.
Math             8 cr Algebra II equivalent (may be waived); statistics
Composition      9 cr Two quarters for freshmen, one for sophomores
			plus two writing-intensive courses.
Foreign Languag  6 cr Intermediate Level (BA only)
Computing        4 cr 
Breadth          8 cr Two courses from different content areas outside
			the area of the major (This limit is NEW).

Very little comment has reached us about the following:
Service	         2 cr Philosophy of Service course + fieldwork.

The departments involved raise objections to the following tentative
proposals:

Communication    3 cr (Department wishes 4 credits, does not support
		Communication- and Writing- intensive courses.

Health		 3 cr (Physical Education department proposes 6 credits,
			including required 1-credit activity courses the
			sophomore, junior, and senior years.)

			To register your input on these issues before
			the vote, please address the list, or send them
			to me personally (russell).
			
			Thank you very much,
				Malcolm Russell

From: "Daniel E. Turk" 
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 07:45:58 -0500 (EST)

Malcolm listed the topics and credits that have been discussed and
"supported" for many GE areas.  I'm wondering if that is all the vote is
about tomorrow, or if it also includes what will be "required" each
year.  We have also discussed what really would be good to "require"
each year and what we could leave as "electives".  Is this also a part
of tomorrow's decision?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dan Turk                  turk@acm.org                       Ph.D. Student
(770) 984-2359            turk@gsu.edu             CIS Dept, Georgia State
==========================================================================

Date: Tue, 14 Nov 95 08:02:29 EST
From: "" 
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow

Malcolm--

I suggest the following compromises:

1.

Date: Tue, 14 Nov 95 08:02:59 EST
From: "" 
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow

Malcolm--

I suggest the following compromises:

1.

Date: Tue, 14 Nov 95 08:04:15 EST
From: "" 
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow

Malcolm--

apologies for the mistakes in sending messages

I suggest the following compromises--

1.  For service:  An S course (could be in major, minor, etc.) or could be 
the Philosophy of Service course(which would be 2 credits)

2.

Date: Tue, 14 Nov 95 08:06:10 EST
From: "" 
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow

Malcolm--

I am having a terrible time with my e-mail today--forgive me


I suggest the following:

1.  An S course for service (from major, minor, etc.) or the 2-credit 
Philosophy of Service

2.  For P.E., the 3-credit basic health sequence, plus 1 credit of activity 
for two more years--total of 5

3.

Date: Tue, 14 Nov 95 08:08:45 EST
From: "" 
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow

Malcolm--

One last suggestion--

3.  Communication--four days, three credits  --call the 4th day a lab, and 
count it as such on teacher loads.  

I think my suggestions result in no real increase unless the 2-credit 
course in service is chosen instead of an S course.

Delmer

Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 08:53:25 -0500 (EST)
From: Patricia Scott 
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow

I would support the entire package proposed, as long as I am correct in 
understanding that the "breadth" requirement can refer to cognates, since 
we don't have any room for electives as it is.  Accrediting agencies 
require everything we have on our list.  I also support Communications (4 
credits, and more writing) and I suppose if the vote goes that way the 
university in general will see to it that they have sufficent FTEs.  
Hurray for PE who believe in more health oriented courses as a 
requirement: so do I, and it should include mental health.
Again thanks for this forum!
--Patricia

On Tue, 14 Nov 1995, Malcolm Russell wrote:

> Colleagues,
> 
> Tomorrow theGeneral Education committee is scheduled to vote on the
> proposed new requirements for the BA and BS degrees.
> 
> Am I right in assuming that the proposed requirements and credits fall
> into the following categories?                   
> 
> Essentially agreed and supported:
> Religion      	16 cr including choice of a team-taught capstone course
> Arts&Humanities	12 cr Divided into Ideas and History (3cr + 3 cr) and
> 			 Arts & Literature (3 cr + 3 cr).
> Natural Science  8 cr Two laboratory-based core courses, or alternative
> 			 list for science majors, cognates, etc.
> Social Science   8 cr Two of three interdisciplinary core courses OR
> 			discipline-based courses for majors, cognates,
>                         etc.
> Math             8 cr Algebra II equivalent (may be waived); statistics
> Composition      9 cr Two quarters for freshmen, one for sophomores
> 			plus two writing-intensive courses.
> Foreign Languag  6 cr Intermediate Level (BA only)
> Computing        4 cr 
> Breadth          8 cr Two courses from different content areas outside
> 			the area of the major (This limit is NEW).
> 
> Very little comment has reached us about the following:
> Service	         2 cr Philosophy of Service course + fieldwork.
> 
> The departments involved raise objections to the following tentative
> proposals:
> 
> Communication    3 cr (Department wishes 4 credits, does not support
> 		Communication- and Writing- intensive courses.
> 
> Health		 3 cr (Physical Education department proposes 6 credits,
> 			including required 1-credit activity courses the
> 			sophomore, junior, and senior years.)
> 
> 			To register your input on these issues before
> 			the vote, please address the list, or send them
> 			to me personally (russell).
> 			
> 			Thank you very much,
> 				Malcolm Russell
> 

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Required Yearly courses voted Tomorrow?
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 10:48:39 -0500 (EST)

In response to Dan (below)

Yes. This will be part of tomorrow's agenda. As you know, it's been
floating around the list for a while.
    Malcolm
    
    > 
> Malcolm listed the topics and credits that have been discussed and
> "supported" for many GE areas.  I'm wondering if that is all the vote is
> about tomorrow, or if it also includes what will be "required" each
> year.  We have also discussed what really would be good to "require"
> each year and what we could leave as "electives".  Is this also a part
> of tomorrow's decision?
> 
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Dan Turk                  turk@acm.org                       Ph.D. Student
> (770) 984-2359            turk@gsu.edu             CIS Dept, Georgia State
> ==========================================================================
> 

From: "Daniel E. Turk" 
Subject: Re: Required Yearly courses voted Tomorrow?
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 11:57:44 -0500 (EST)

> In response to Dan (below)
> 
> Yes. This will be part of tomorrow's agenda. As you know, it's been
> floating around the list for a while.

Then, again, I would urge that the computing course GE requirement be
put in the first year, and that some other less necessary classes (oh,
can I say this with Malcolm listening?!) like history... be delayed.
Just my 2 cents worth.  I think that the skills are VERY IMPORTANT for
people to have up front!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dan Turk                  turk@acm.org                       Ph.D. Student
(770) 984-2359            turk@gsu.edu             CIS Dept, Georgia State
==========================================================================

Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 13:52:21 -0500 (EST)
From: William Richardson 
Subject: ge requirement for pe

I think we must treat the PE proposal more seriously. How about a 
one credit concepts course and a one credit activities course each year in 
attendance thereafter. If we really believe in the education of the 
physical as well as the mental and spiritual, how can we emasculate the 
whole discipline? Our increase in math may enable some students to be 
able to reason better, but if they haven't learned good principles of 
health and fitness, their reasoning powers will be eviscerated by 
sluggish bodies and minds. The individual portfolio for fitness is a 
records-keeping nightmare, and would be an exercise in "let's pretend."  

From: paden@andrews.edu (Ray Paden)
Subject: Re: ge requirement for pe
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 14:28:03 -0500 (EST)

Hi,

   In response to Bill's suggestion below, I do not believe that activity 
   courses for credit is the only way to accomplish this goal.  4 religion
   classes in 4 years does not make a student religious.  AU provides chapels,
   church services, dorm worships and other such things to help foster the
   spiritual development of the student.  A 3 credit health class accompanied
   by mandatory, non credit, activities courses can compliment each other in
   the same manner as religion classes and worship/chapel/church compliment
   each other.  This does not "emasculate" the whole discipline and will 
   allow us to require more physical activity of the students then we can
   by limiting it to the number of credits we can spare for such things.
   Active life style is important, but I am not certain that merely taking 1 
   class a year will establish a yearning for an active life style.  Notre
   Dame requires all freshman to participate in activity courses for the 
   entire freshman year for non credit.  Surely we can do the same thing
   here at AU for the student's soph-sr years with health class their freshman
   year.

Regards,
Ray
> 
> I think we must treat the PE proposal more seriously. How about a 
> one credit concepts course and a one credit activities course each year in 
> attendance thereafter. If we really believe in the education of the 
> physical as well as the mental and spiritual, how can we emasculate the 
> whole discipline? Our increase in math may enable some students to be 
> able to reason better, but if they haven't learned good principles of 
> health and fitness, their reasoning powers will be eviscerated by 
> sluggish bodies and minds. The individual portfolio for fitness is a 
> records-keeping nightmare, and would be an exercise in "let's pretend."  
> 


-- 
 -----------------------------------------------------------------
| paden@andrews.edu     |  "Of making many books there is no end, |
| Raymond L. Paden      |  and much study wearies the body."      |
| Chair, CSIS Dept.     |                 -- Eccl. 12:12          |
| Andrews University     -----------------------------------------|
| Berrien Springs, MI 49104-0360                                  |
| (616) 471-3214                                                  |
 -----------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 14:35:30 -0500 (EST)
From: Patricia Scott 
Subject: Re: ge requirement for pe

Amen!

On Tue, 14 Nov 1995, William Richardson wrote:

> I think we must treat the PE proposal more seriously. How about a 
> one credit concepts course and a one credit activities course each year in 
> attendance thereafter. If we really believe in the education of the 
> physical as well as the mental and spiritual, how can we emasculate the 
> whole discipline? Our increase in math may enable some students to be 
> able to reason better, but if they haven't learned good principles of 
> health and fitness, their reasoning powers will be eviscerated by 
> sluggish bodies and minds. The individual portfolio for fitness is a 
> records-keeping nightmare, and would be an exercise in "let's pretend."  
> 

Date: Wed, 15 Nov 1995 10:13:35 -0500 (EST)
From: William Richardson 
Subject: GE PE requirement

In response to Ray's suggestion that we offer mandatory PE activities 
courses but give no credit and presumably no grades, have we figured out 
how we will do that? Have we discussed a control or policing method for 
such requirements? Also, will students be charged for classes that give 
them no credit? By the way, Ray, if a computer class makes a student more 
computer friendly, it's possible that a religion class, though it might 
not make a student religious, might make her/him a little more religion 
friendly. And remember, some students have permanent excuses from chapels 
and dorm worships.

Date: Wed, 15 Nov 1995 13:30:46 -0500 (EST)
From: Alice Williams 
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow

Guess I'm entering this discussion later in the week and day than most of 
you--after the vote this morning and all the new discussion.  Reviewing the 
comments of the last day or so reminds me that we can never satisfy 
everyone all the time.  Of necessity there will be compromises; teachers 
will wish certain things were handled better, in more depth, and with 
more comprehension by students; and, always, some students will question 
the necessity or validity of certain GE requirements.  I suspect that
whenever all the dust settles, we will manage to make do with what we
decided and continue the minor "course corrections" for the next 10-15 years.
I'm impressed by the committee's hard work even though I don't quite agree
with all the details or compromises.

I am interested in the format and orientation of the service course or 
requirement.  Back in ancient times, when I was a college student, 
service seemed to be defined as serving God by serving people--usually, 
but not always as an employee of "the church" ("the work" for those of 
you even older than me!) or in health-care or education or some other job 
setting that involved service to people.  Of course, some of those people 
sufffered burnout from serving too many hours of the day for too many 
years.  Over time, the concept of having a service orientation in one's life 
seems have developed a connotation of volunteer work in the community--in 
addition to however the individual earns a living, perhaps without regard 
to how much time the person devotes to the job.  I'm don't think that one is 
more important than the other--they both have their place.  But how we 
communicate an attitude of service--and how we model it to our students--is 
related to our concept of how and when and where service takes place.  
Since we Adventists have so much trouble with perfectionism and work 
addiction, we run the risk of setting up even more requirements--allegedly 
for spiritual health--than students (or ourselves) and possibly meet.

I hope that our concept of service--taught and modeled--includes the ideas 
that people are more important than things, and that there is deep 
satisfaction to be found in serving others, whether on the job or through 
volunteer service, or both.  The change of pace offered by volunteer 
service can be an important balance to the demands of a job.  If either 
become only a "resume builder," we have still failed the student.

Date: Wed, 15 Nov 1995 13:47:59 -0500 (EST)
From: Alice Williams 
Subject: Decisions


I seem to have entered the discussion a bit after the fact.  Most of my 
concerns have been addressed with more lucidity than I can muster at this 
time. 

I am interested in how the service class/requirement will be 
conceptualized.  In the "dark ages" when I was a student, I had the 
impression that a "service mentality" could--and in Adventist circles, 
should--be applied to a career of service to others, in or outside "the 
work" or denominational employment.  Traditionally, this meant education, 
pastoral, or health careers, but other fields were included.  Lately, the 
concept seems more oriented toward volunteer work.  I think both are 
important.  I am concerned that in our teaching and modeling to students, 
they understand that service is an attitude, not a location or a 
vocation.  Our modeling of the rewards of serving others in various roles 
is at least as important as the teaching of a formal class.

Date: Wed, 15 Nov 1995 13:30:46 -0500 (EST)
From: Alice Williams 
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow

Guess I'm entering this discussion later in the week and day than most of 
you--after the vote this morning and all the new discussion.  Reviewing the 
comments of the last day or so reminds me that we can never satisfy 
everyone all the time.  Of necessity there will be compromises; teachers 
will wish certain things were handled better, in more depth, and with 
more comprehension by students; and, always, some students will question 
the necessity or validity of certain GE requirements.  I suspect that
whenever all the dust settles, we will manage to make do with what we
decided and continue the minor "course corrections" for the next 10-15 years.
I'm impressed by the committee's hard work even though I don't quite agree
with all the details or compromises.

I am interested in the format and orientation of the service course or 
requirement.  Back in ancient times, when I was a college student, 
service seemed to be defined as serving God by serving people--usually, 
but not always as an employee of "the church" ("the work" for those of 
you even older than me!) or in health-care or education or some other job 
setting that involved service to people.  Of course, some of those people 
sufffered burnout from serving too many hours of the day for too many 
years.  Over time, the concept of having a service orientation in one's life 
seems have developed a connotation of volunteer work in the community--in 
addition to however the individual earns a living, perhaps without regard 
to how much time the person devotes to the job.  I'm don't think that one is 
more important than the other--they both have their place.  But how we 
communicate an attitude of service--and how we model it to our students--is 
related to our concept of how and when and where service takes place.  
Since we Adventists have so much trouble with perfectionism and work 
addiction, we run the risk of setting up even more requirements--allegedly 
for spiritual health--than students (or ourselves) and possibly meet.

I hope that our concept of service--taught and modeled--includes the ideas 
that people are more important than things, and that there is deep 
satisfaction to be found in serving others, whether on the job or through 
volunteer service, or both.  The change of pace offered by volunteer 
service can be an important balance to the demands of a job.  If either 
become only a "resume builder," we have still failed the student.

Date: Wed, 15 Nov 1995 13:30:46 -0500 (EST)
From: Alice Williams 
Subject: Re: Tough Decisions Scheduled Tomorrow

Guess I'm entering this discussion later in the week and day than most of 
you--after the vote this morning and all the new discussion.  Reviewing the 
comments of the last day or so reminds me that we can never satisfy 
everyone all the time.  Of necessity there will be compromises; teachers 
will wish certain things were handled better, in more depth, and with 
more comprehension by students; and, always, some students will question 
the necessity or validity of certain GE requirements.  I suspect that
whenever all the dust settles, we will manage to make do with what we
decided and continue the minor "course corrections" for the next 10-15 years.
I'm impressed by the committee's hard work even though I don't quite agree
with all the details or compromises.

I am interested in the format and orientation of the service course or 
requirement.  Back in ancient times, when I was a college student, 
service seemed to be defined as serving God by serving people--usually, 
but not always as an employee of "the church" ("the work" for those of 
you even older than me!) or in health-care or education or some other job 
setting that involved service to people.  Of course, some of those people 
sufffered burnout from serving too many hours of the day for too many 
years.  Over time, the concept of having a service orientation in one's life 
seems have developed a connotation of volunteer work in the community--in 
addition to however the individual earns a living, perhaps without regard 
to how much time the person devotes to the job.  I'm don't think that one is 
more important than the other--they both have their place.  But how we 
communicate an attitude of service--and how we model it to our students--is 
related to our concept of how and when and where service takes place.  
Since we Adventists have so much trouble with perfectionism and work 
addiction, we run the risk of setting up even more requirements--allegedly 
for spiritual health--than students (or ourselves) and possibly meet.

I hope that our concept of service--taught and modeled--includes the ideas 
that people are more important than things, and that there is deep 
satisfaction to be found in serving others, whether on the job or through 
volunteer service, or both.  The change of pace offered by volunteer 
service can be an important balance to the demands of a job.  If either 
become only a "resume builder," we have still failed the student.

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Service (was "Decisions")
Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 07:05:45 -0500 (EST)

Alice Williams' remarks below touches on a very important fact. We need
to think about that attitude of service. So Alice, why not volunteer to
teach a section of the proposed Philosophy of Service course?  Provided 
your load permits....
	Malcolm> 
> 
> I seem to have entered the discussion a bit after the fact.  Most of my 
> concerns have been addressed with more lucidity than I can muster at this 
> time. 
> 
> I am interested in how the service class/requirement will be 
> conceptualized.  In the "dark ages" when I was a student, I had the 
> impression that a "service mentality" could--and in Adventist circles, 
> should--be applied to a career of service to others, in or outside "the 
> work" or denominational employment.  Traditionally, this meant education, 
> pastoral, or health careers, but other fields were included.  Lately, the 
> concept seems more oriented toward volunteer work.  I think both are 
> important.  I am concerned that in our teaching and modeling to students, 
> they understand that service is an attitude, not a location or a 
> vocation.  Our modeling of the rewards of serving others in various roles 
> is at least as important as the teaching of a formal class.
> 
> 

Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 09:00:52 -0500 (EST)
From: Neville Webster 
Subject: Re: GE PE requirement

Further to Bill and Ray's comments on PE activities.  My observation, here 
and elsewhere, is that forced PE activities do nothing more than get a 
few floppy students off their butts for one hour a week, which is hardly 
conducive to physical fitness.  The bulk of students are encouraged to 
participate in frequent PE activities from an inner drive (that might be 
awakened by an effective class on health issues), or by attractive and 
interesting facilities provided by the school that draw the students in 
to participate - its fun, not forced.  Maybe we should find more 
effective ways of seeding and nurturing that inner drive.

Neville G. Webster
Associate Professor of Business Administration
School of Business      Management and Marketing Department
Andrews University      Berrien Springs  MICH  49104
Phone:  (616)471-3107

Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 09:34:19 -0500 (EST)
From: Neville Webster 
Subject: Re: Decisions

A comment on Alice William's response to servie requirments.

It seems to me that it would be a lot easier for teachers in so-called 
professional programs (Nursing, PT, Business) to incorporate and model 
the service ideal in our classes.  However, for those teaching basic 
sciences, English, Geography, etc. it may be a lot harder to speak of 
service without a specific goal in mind.  While I might, and do, find it 
easy to speak of a higher goal for businesses (making a real, long-term 
contribution to the community, rather than simply serving up non-soggy 
french frys), it must be a lot harder for and English teacher to raise 
the subject during a discussion of D.H.Lawrence.

So, for that segment of the student body that are not engaged in the 
professional degrees, perhaps we do need a specific class to raise issues 
that would not otherwise be raised.  However, the personal modelling of 
service can indeed be a part of every teachers life.

Neville G. Webster
Associate Professor of Business Administration
School of Business      Management and Marketing Department
Andrews University      Berrien Springs  MICH  49104
Phone:  (616)471-3107


From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: A Question and a Comment
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 07:37:58 -0500 (EST)

Colleagues,

After spending a rather restless night pondering that section of
yesterday's faculty meeting devoted to General Education, I'm left with
a question and a comment.

The question: What should the GE committee learn from the comments that
were made?

The Comment: During the last nine months of discussion, the committee
and faculty members frequently approached GE from fundamentally opposite
perspectives. We on the committee should have realized this difference
much earlier, but at least we need to draw attention to it now.

The committee began by asking "What do students need to
learn/experience/develop as values in GE."

The traditional faculty view--not only at AU is--What should we teach in
GE.

When Dr. Johnston faults the lack of Biblical content courses, he
reflects the traaditional view. By contrast, if we approach the issue of
religious education from the perspective of student learning and values,
for many of our students a fact-based "Survey of OT" is about the last
thing they need.

Likewise, when Dr. Hill comments that because they're nice people, the
English professors have worked out a compromise humanities core, she
reflected, most admirably, a passion to teach her discipline. Again,
though, GE must be about student learning. It may not take forms that
faculty members initially find exciting, though frequently the results
are far more satisfying than the initial predictions.

Yet a third example is Dr. Bauer's objection that people outside
communication should not be teaching communication. The proposal has
never been that faculty outside the Communication Department "teach"
communication. Instead, it has been that _Students Continue Learning to
Communicate_. Besides their experience in communication courses, our
students need substantial experience communicating the content material
of their chosen discipline to those trained in the discipline. Many
faculty members already recognize this, and not a few require students
in one class or another to make a presentation. This helps--as a
comparison over the years of students in the senior Honors Seminar
shows. Students from departments with disciplinary seminars typically
perform far more confidently--and well--than those who do not.

The C-based courses, then, would formalize and extend such courses. They
would provide training for faculty members willing to devote time to
improving the organization and evaluation of the student presentations.

At the risk of continuing too long: does this student-learning based
approach make sense?
	Malcolm

Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:20:41 -0500 (EST)
From: Neville Webster 
Subject: Re: A Question and a Comment

I want to support Malcolm and his committee in their basic approach to 
the GE question.  History teaches us that too many business firms and 
even industries have disappeared simply because they focussed soley on 
what they could do and how they could do it better, rather than on what 
the customer really needed.   Focussing on the student's long-term needs 
should be our primary concern.  Those needs must be determined by the 
combined input from students, parents, employers and ourselves.  But the 
focus is not on our own interests and skills.

I am sure that each discipline could very easily provide a much more 
extensive program for each student, more English, more Communications, 
more Math, more Bible.  But we have them only for 4 years, and only part 
of the time is allocated to GE.  Therefore we have to make some tough 
choices and slot into the time available only those subjects that will at 
least introduce them to a broad understanding of their world and prepare 
them for higher level courses in their chosen majors.  I believe that I 
could make a strong case for a basic business course to be included in 
the GE list.  After all, who among us does not daily need some knowledge 
of the all-encompassing world of business in which we live.  However, 
there are obviously much more basic areas of knowledge needed by students 
to set the foundation.  So, business gets left out.  They will learn 
about it soon enough in the real world.

I think the committee has done a splendid job of wrestling with the 
alternatives and drawing up a balanced list of GE requirements.  Let's 
accept their wider perspective, and reject the narrow parochialism of 
individual departments.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Neville G. Webster
Associate Professor of Business Administration
School of Business      Management and Marketing Department
Andrews University      Berrien Springs  MICH  49104
Phone:  (616)471-3107
===========================================================

Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:35:10 -0500
From: "J. Mailen Kootsey" 
Subject: Re: A Question and a Comment

Malcolm wrote...

>...
>At the risk of continuing too long: does this student-learning based
>approach make sense?

Yes, I think it does make sense and it is a natural fit with our growing
need to demonstrate that our teaching is producing a change in the
students, i.e. the need for assessment.

I think there is also another aspect that some faculty are ignoring. They
speak as though someone outside their discipline has decided (for them)
how many hours should be necessary to teach their material, skills, or
ideas.  This is not the process at all.  The credits have been set by a
series of decisions based on necessities other than those in the disciplines.
It starts with the total number of credits taken by a student in four years
(180-190).  Then we had to decide what fraction of the total to devote to
GE, based on several factors such as what other schools are doing and
achieving a reasonable balance with majors and minors. The final step is
trying to apportion the available GE credits to all the disciplines included,
i.e. giving roughly "equal pain" to all in trying to get their message
across.  All would like more hours, but in the current state of education,
this is all that is available!  As Gary Land said to me yesterday, "I could
teach world history in 1 hour or 100.  Obviously I would rather have more
that 1, but if one is all that is available I would do the best I could
with that hour!"

Mailen Kootsey

From: paden@andrews.edu (Ray Paden)
Subject: Re: A Question and a Comment
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 09:45:02 -0500 (EST)

Malcomb,
> 
> The question: What should the GE committee learn from the comments that
> were made?

ANS:  I think I explained this yesterday on the phone, but I have a response
      to the next comment.

> At the risk of continuing too long: does this student-learning based
> approach make sense?

ANS:  Yes it makes sense.  The problem is to mesh teaching styles with learning
      styles.  If develop a class based on teacher interest/ability/style only
      the student may or may not benefit.  If we develop class based on student
      need/learning style only, teacher may have problem.  Both perspectives 
      have merit.  BUT, as professionals, teachers should be willing to try new 
      alternatives keeping in mind the "customer" needs/learning style.  I
      have heard very little teacher comment considering the needs of the
      students in general faculty forums.

      Having said this, I do not think what we have proposed is so outlandish
      (especially after numerous compromises looking at teacher interest only!)
      that it can not work except for perhaps a small number of faculty.

Regards,
Ray
 -----------------------------------------------------------------
| paden@andrews.edu     |  "Of making many books there is no end, |
| Raymond L. Paden      |  and much study wearies the body."      |
| Chair, CSIS Dept.     |                 -- Eccl. 12:12          |
| Andrews University     -----------------------------------------|
| Berrien Springs, MI 49104-0360                                  |
| (616) 471-3214                                                  |
 -----------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 11:05:00 -0500
From: mcbride@andrews.edu (Duane C. McBride)
Subject: Re: A Question and a Comment

I think that a student based learning approach makes a lot of sence, but I
really do not agree that the GE committee is the only representative of
that view.  The committee seems to view itself in that light, but I am not
sure many of the rest of us agree.  I think many of us believe that we are
taking a strong student learning perspective, it is just that we have very
different refernt points that may be based on very valid experiences and
contacts with students and with those in graduate programs and the work
place.

It is to bad that these views were not represented in the GE committee, but
that seemed to be a choice of the process.

Duane

Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 13:52:00 -0500 (EST)
From: Keith Mattingly 
Subject: Re: A Question and a Comment

Student learning is a worthy goal.  I just wonder if the Communications 
and English departments will be given opportunity to interact with those 
teaching C and W courses and thus expand their influence and at the same 
time provide helpful suggestions, or perhaps even be given some overt 
control in the courses.

We in the religion department will be team teaching the "capstone" 
religion courses.  Perhaps something along that line might work out for 
the above two departments.

KM

Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:05:21 -0500 (EST)
From: William Richardson 
Subject: none

Surely we should not be very surprised when suggestions for major 
curriculum changes cause volcanic reaction. We should be surprised and 
disappointed if a group of creative, well-educated people quietly 
accepted major directives in their field of expertise and raised no  
questions/objections/barricades. Someone has said, "Changing the 
curriculum is like moving a graveyard, you don't get alot of internal 
help." But I disagree with that sentiment. With a group like ours, we get 
lots of help--just not necessarily the kind we may want. In spite of all 
the pressing deadlines, I think we need a few more sessions like this 
week's faculty meeting. The thought was expressed in the GE committee 
that at some Universities, when such changes were proposed, they didn't 
want individual departments making a case for their discipline. But we 
are seeing the results of that kind of reasoning. In spite of our 
limited time, I think we need something like a week end retreat (although 
it would probably be hard to have a restful Sabbath!), when some of the 
under-girding philosophizing the committee did could be shared more 
broadly. And while we on the committee kept trying to keep the needs of 
the students in mind, who of us could say that we were completely neutral 
when the discussion impinged on our favorite discipline. And as Duane 
suggested, while the committee was representative, some departments, 
with insights as clear as those of us on the committee, were not 
represented at all. A couple more faculty meetings of an hour or so is 
simply not enough time, especially when there are quite a few loose ends 
that need tied up. It is becoming increasingly frustrating to have 
questions answered with "That's something we will have to eventually 
address." If we're serious about having the freshman classes all figured 
out in less than 2 months, I think the whole faculty should have a 
couple of marathon sessions. Happy holidays everybody!
Bill    

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Re: A Question and a Comment
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 15:51:58 -0500 (EST)

Keith Mattingly wrote
> 
> Student learning is a worthy goal.  I just wonder if the Communications 
> and English departments will be given opportunity to interact with those 
> teaching C and W courses and thus expand their influence and at the same 
> time provide helpful suggestions, or perhaps even be given some overt 
> control in the courses.
	They will clearly be asked to be involved in workshops where
	criteria will be developed for judging presentations and
	writing, as well as matters such as reasonable scheduling these
	things in the syllabus.
	> 
> We in the religion department will be team teaching the "capstone" 
> religion courses.  Perhaps something along that line might work out for 
> the above two departments.
	For departments that wish this, see the Dean--a fine idea.
	
	> 
> KM
> 

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: An Explanation about Communication
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 16:43:17 -0500 (EST)

Perhaps the faculty on this list serve would like to know the
recommendations of the GE committee about communication.

Although I have not yet seen the minutes, as I recall we voted
that COMM104 remain a 3-credit course. However, we recommended that the
Communication Department consider restructuring the class, so that the
large amount of class time spent listening to student presentations be
considered--in part at least--a lab. This would allow the class to meet
four periods per week.

The greater number of periods would in turn allow more time to be spent
on cross-cultural communication. 

To compensate for the faculty time, we recognized that faculty receive
credit for lab sessions.

Separately, to encourage students to gain experience making
presentations appropriate (where possible) to their discipline, we voted
the requirement of one communication-intensive course.

Although it has not been formalized, we also favor including COMM104 in
the freshman year package. Consequently the rise in enrollment of
COMM104 would offset in the long run the loss of students in COMM306.
There will be a temporary bulge, of course---one that would be made far
worse if COMM104 became a 4-credit class.

You might also be interested in knowing the communication credits
required:

	AUC: 0; CUC, 4.5; LSU, 0; PUC, 3; SC, 4.5; Union, 3.
	Notre Dame, 0; Valparaiso, 1.5; Goshen, 0/3; Wheaton, 3; 
	Bethel, 4.5.  Calvin College = 12 credits including
	composition.

	The LaSierra reduction is the latest action decision we know.

In the opinion of the faculty, is an increase in communication credits
from 3 to 4 the sort of issue that should stop approval of the proposed
package?
	Malcolm

Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 22:51:56 -0500 (EST)
From: William Proulx 
Subject: GE 3 credit Health Requirement


   On the first page of the "GE proposals for Wednesday's faculty
meeting" was a listing of the most important changes to the GE
requirements that have been proposed.  Included in this list was the
revision to the Health and Fitness requirements.  Interestingly, it was
stated these changes were designed to "increase the utilization of the PE
departments equipment and requiring PEAC courses for students whose
fitness does not measure up".  Unfortunately, this is a very narrow view
of what constitutes health and possibly demonstrates a lack of
representation or input to the committee dealing with this aspect of the
GE program.  Health professionals with a broad understanding of health no
longer speak of fitness but wellness when they consider health.  The
difference is that the first is only a component of the latter.  An
anology to the current proposal for health would be if when we thought of
spirituality we only considered bible study and therefore designed the
Religion requirement so it only focused on bible study while ignoring
prayer and witnessing. 

  Although many of us would like to see more credits go to helping students
prevent heart disease, cancer, diabetes, osteoporosis, mental illness, low
birth weight pregnacies, fetal alchohol syndrome, and other conditions we
realize there are only so many credits to go around.  Therefore, it is
imperative that the three credits designated to "wellness"  be used
wisely.  So few credits leaves no room for a course design that has
been given insufficient thought.  The present recommendation to fragment the
three credit health requirement into 1 credit segments, in my opinion will
not efficiently use the time given to health.  Take any other GE
requirement and fragment it into 1 credit segments, each dealing with
a different aspect of the topic and I think you can begin to see the
potential pitfalls of such a proposal. 

Therefore, I would like us to consider making the "wellness"  requirement
a single 3 credit interdisciplinary course coordinated by an individual(s)
with broad understanding of all the important components of wellness. 
This would ensure greater continuity of the course content.




Bill Proulx
Assistant Professor of Nutrition

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Re: GE 3 credit Health Requirement
Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 11:53:55 -0500 (EST)

Bill Proulx presented a very well reasoned proposal below for unifying
the "health" credits. It will certainly make the committee agenda, and
it is the sort of comment that inspires a better university.

Certainly the terminologoy can be changed--I can't yet imagine a
magazine titled "Vibrant Wellness", but if wellness is both appropriate
and understood, so much the better.

Perhaps the heart of Bill's note is that he would feel far more
comfortable with a 3-credit Wellness course, taught all at once, rather
than a course taught consecutive quarters. On the other hand, the PE
faculty see a great benefit from a year-long sequence that is much more
likely to affect lifestyle than ten hurried weeks.

Speaking for at least this member of the committee, I see something of a
trade-off. Moreover, we hope to see a joint design for the three-quarter
course involving faculty from several departments. Would the level of
student learning necessarily fall that much? Would the content really
vary significantly if the course were taught in consecutive class
periods in one quarter rather than several?

Finally, since the proposal represents an increase, for most students,
of 200% in the credits devoted to the non-fitness portion of wellness,
and since the one-credit, three quarter course can probably be required
of all freshmen, but due to scheduling difficulties another 3-credit
course could not, isn't the plan still worth trying?
	Malcolm
	> 
> 
>    On the first page of the "GE proposals for Wednesday's faculty
> meeting" was a listing of the most important changes to the GE
> requirements that have been proposed.  Included in this list was the
> revision to the Health and Fitness requirements.  Interestingly, it was
> stated these changes were designed to "increase the utilization of the PE
> departments equipment and requiring PEAC courses for students whose
> fitness does not measure up".  Unfortunately, this is a very narrow view
> of what constitutes health and possibly demonstrates a lack of
> representation or input to the committee dealing with this aspect of the
> GE program.  Health professionals with a broad understanding of health no
> longer speak of fitness but wellness when they consider health.  The
> difference is that the first is only a component of the latter.  An
> anology to the current proposal for health would be if when we thought of
> spirituality we only considered bible study and therefore designed the
> Religion requirement so it only focused on bible study while ignoring
> prayer and witnessing. 
> 
>   Although many of us would like to see more credits go to helping students
> prevent heart disease, cancer, diabetes, osteoporosis, mental illness, low
> birth weight pregnacies, fetal alchohol syndrome, and other conditions we
> realize there are only so many credits to go around.  Therefore, it is
> imperative that the three credits designated to "wellness"  be used
> wisely.  So few credits leaves no room for a course design that has
> been given insufficient thought.  The present recommendation to fragment the
> three credit health requirement into 1 credit segments, in my opinion will
> not efficiently use the time given to health.  Take any other GE
> requirement and fragment it into 1 credit segments, each dealing with
> a different aspect of the topic and I think you can begin to see the
> potential pitfalls of such a proposal. 
> 
> Therefore, I would like us to consider making the "wellness"  requirement
> a single 3 credit interdisciplinary course coordinated by an individual(s)
> with broad understanding of all the important components of wellness. 
> This would ensure greater continuity of the course content.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bill Proulx
> Assistant Professor of Nutrition
> 

Date: Fri, 1 Dec 1995 12:54:58 -0500 (EST)
From: Patricia Scott 
Subject: More comment

I heartily endorse the idea of further extended faculty meetings 
regarding ge requirements.  I fear that unless we all FEEL ownership of 
the proposal, it will not pass, and I strongly believe it should, 
although with some modifications.  

I am concerned with the W-intensive upper division courses in the major; 
I am a very firm advocate of correct writing (and according to university 
and departmental style/format) but question the amount of time it would 
take both teachers and students to do this effectively, considering the 
fact that we have mandated content and students have to pass national 
exams on completion of the program.  We tend to use multiple choice 
questions because that is the form the national exams take.  

I guess I need to know more about what is meant by W intensive, as well.  
Would one well written paper per quarter satisfy the requirement?  That 
might work for us.  It would require us looking at our program objectives 
to be sure we include literary skills in our objectives, which is perhaps 
the whole point, and certainly not a bad idea.  Few nursing departments 
where I have worked have concentrated adequately on writing skills; this 
may mean intensive retraining for faculty, if this has not been part of 
their previous education.  I suspect more than "workshops" will be 
required for adeqate preparation.  I also suspect we are not alone in this.

And a question:  Would it not be better to delay the implementation of 
the revisions a year, in the meantime gathering support and easing 
people's anxieties, or is there some pressing reason why it has to be 
done 1996?

From: "" 
Date: Fri, 1 Dec 95 14:54:17 EST
Subject: Proposal Support

Colleagues:

First to the GE committee:  Regardless of the composition of the GE 
committee and the time spent thinking of what to include or of creative 
ways to package and deliver it, there will not be unanimity with the 
outcome.  However, I think that you have done well on a challenging and 
difficult task.  Clearly, as a result of exchanges on the net and in 
faculty meeting, there are still some areas where fine tuning is 
necessary, but the frame work on which to make them has been established.

To my colleagues:  No, the proposal isn't perfect, but it certainly is 
workable.  Although I was a member of the Natural Sciences subcommittee, 
the Department of Chemistry and Biochemistry did not walk away with 
everything my faculty consider essential for a student to be scientifically 
literate in this day and age.  I think is is also true for the other 
science departments.  Thus, we (Chemistry and Biochemistry faculty) will do 
the best we can with the amount of time we have and will try to provide 
students the tools they need to pursue some ideas on their own.  The best 
learning occurs when the person is motivated enough to do it on their own, 
without the prodding of exams, etc.

I support the proposed GE package and urge others to do so as well.  Sure 
there are items that need additional work, but not so much that the package 
should be scuttled.  Even though I'm a professional chemist and have an in-
depth knowledge of selected portions of the discipline, I can and do 
benefit from suggestions about what aspects of chemistry non-chemist 
colleagues and students find interesting and applicable in their lives.  
I'm in a better position to know how to teach such material to students 
than they are and have the background to tie it other concepts, etc.  To 
say that I and my chemistry colleagues are the final authorities about what 
constitutes the most useful general knowledge a person should have of 
chemistry would be arrogant and might not correlate well with the 
experience(s) of others.  Certainly, we have our ideas and they should 
given credence, but not to the extent that other ideas and options are 
ignored.

I am interested in the C- and W- course designations.  For a number of 
years my department has believed in and practiced the Writing Across the 
Curriculum philosophy.  While I'm not teaching English, I examine all 
papers for scientific content, grammar and spelling.  I benefitted greatly 
by a workshop for WAC arranged by Ray Leadbetter several years ago.  I 
learned that identifying a few of the major problems with a paper is far 
better and less time consuming than covering the page with red ink.  Thus, 
I can grade faster and the students can work on a reasonable number of 
problems at a time.  Although I don't consider myself or my department as a 
model, I know it can be done with minimal pain.  Perhaps none of our 
classes would get the designation of W-, but I'd be interested in 
discovering how the designation would be decided on--also for C-.

I'm not really done yet, but its getting late Friday afternoon and this is 
already tooooooooo l-o-n-g!!  Have a great weekend.

Cheers.
*********************************************************************
* G. William Mutch                Phone: (616)471-3248 (voice mail) *
* Department of Chemistry                       Fax:  (616)471-6396 * 
* Andrews University                      E-Mail: mutch@andrews.edu *
* Berrien Springs, MI  49104-0430                                   *
*********************************************************************

Date: Sat, 2 Dec 1995 23:55:48 -0500
From: mutchp@andrews.edu (Patricia Mutch)
Subject: Re: More comment

Patricia Scott has asked the question whether revisions in GE should be 
postponed a year.  I see at least two reasons why we should move forward to 
implement it for entering freshmen, fall '96.  First, three years have 
already passed since the process was begun -- the committee is fatigued, 
some will probably be unable to take a fourth year, so further delay creates 
risks of lost momentum.  

The more controversial aspects of the package (with exception of 
health/p.e.) are two years away in implementation anyway, giving some time 
to make further refinements if the committee wishes to do so.  The second, 
and to me very crucial reason, is related to the need to have the general 
education revision as a key element for the case statement to use in raising 
funds for the renovation of Nethery Hall.  The longer we wait to make some 
changes in GenEd, the longer we must live with a decrepit central campus 
building!  

I hope we can move forward -- although the plan may not be perfect, it is 
much improved over the present system.  Even the students seem to recognize 
this (reference Wed. Nov. 29 STUDENT MOVEMENT).  We will probably be 
"tweaking" the package for the next decade, anyhow!

>
>And a question:  Would it not be better to delay the implementation of 
>the revisions a year, in the meantime gathering support and easing 
>people's anxieties, or is there some pressing reason why it has to be 
>done 1996?
>
>
Patricia Mutch, Ph.D.
Dean, College of Arts & Sciences
Andrews University
tel 616-471-3411; fax 616-471-6236

Date: Sun, 3 Dec 1995 12:14:30 -0500
From: mcbride@andrews.edu (Duane C. McBride)
Subject: Re: More comment

Pat raises good issues about the need to move on to other crucial things
like campus development.  And most of us have probably gotten a lot of what
we believe students need and what we hear our alumni say they needed.  Pat
also raises interesting questions about the continuation of the GE
committee and the continuing need for tweaking.  Is this to be a standing
committee and will general faculty or area faculty be able to elect
representatives to the GE committee?  That might be nice and might give
confidence to some faculty that they will have a chance to elect
representativess to a committee that is very important to them.

Duane McBride

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: The Continuing Structure of GE--Re McBride
Date: Sun, 3 Dec 1995 12:47:23 -0500 (EST)

Duane raises the important issue of what structure will guide GE 
once the new program is in place with a new director.

The GE committee recommendation includes a GE faculty, whose focus is on
the teaching, as well as a continued committee. The committee should be
chaired by the GE Director, and include both faculty who teach the GE
program and those who do not.

The GE committee has (at least since I arrived in 1977) been appointed
by the university president on the recommendation of the Academic Vice
President. Typically it has been difficult to find faculty  willing to
accept an often-odious task. Consequently, I don't know if an elected
committee would be the most effective, in contrast to one appointed that
reflects both those who teach GE and those who react to what it does to
their students/advisees.

In any case, the issue of how the committee is appointed becomes even
more complex with the counter-suggestion that the committee reports to
the Undergraduate Council and therefore might be considered a
subordinate committee of the council.

Consequently, the present GE committee, even at the discussion stage,
did not feel authorized to structure the selection of its successor
beyond the chair, and the inclusion of faculty members of two types: GE
faculty, and others.

Duane, does this make sense?
	Malcolm
a > 
> Pat raises good issues about the need to move on to other crucial things
> like campus development.  And most of us have probably gotten a lot of what
> we believe students need and what we hear our alumni say they needed.  Pat
> also raises interesting questions about the continuation of the GE
> committee and the continuing need for tweaking.  Is this to be a standing
> committee and will general faculty or area faculty be able to elect
> representatives to the GE committee?  That might be nice and might give
> confidence to some faculty that they will have a chance to elect
> representativess to a committee that is very important to them.
> 
> Duane McBride
> 
> 

Date: Sun, 3 Dec 1995 12:59:39 -0500 (EST)
From: Patricia Scott 
Subject: Re: More comment

I see the pressing reasons why we should implement the GE proposals in 
96, and I still support them in any case.  Clearly the committee has 
worked very hard and done a tremendous job.  Malcolm has responded 
speedily and helpfully to all my questions and concerns.  I think it can 
work.

Date: Sun, 3 Dec 1995 13:21:45 -0500
From: mcbride@andrews.edu (Duane C. McBride)
Subject: Re: The Continuing Structure of GE--Re McBride

I think faculty might feel better representation if they at least chose
some of the committee.  It might help reduce alienation 

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Survey Results & Meeting
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 10:41:19 -0500 (EST)

In the interests of keeping you informed, quickly and cheaply--

Dr. Thayer has analyzed the results of the survey of faculty opinion
regarding the proposed GE reforms. The results suggest that we should
follow the president's urging and move ahead. In every category a
majority of respondents approved the proposal, and we recognize that the
GE committee will need to monitor carefully all areas, but particularly
those whose support is softer. Of those who expressed themselves on the
total package, a whopping 76% approved it.

Dr. Thayer noted that faculty comments divided into several categories.
Some were helpful, others essentially reflected a lack of information. A
final group was hostile to specific changes.

The proposals have now gone to the Undergraduate Council. Although
technically it could have voted on the issue, it did not, pending one
more town hall meeting to discuss the survey results and address
questions that it raises.

Unable to use Chan Shun Auditorium, the science amphitheaters, or other
large classrooms on Wednesday, January 17, we've settled for the
Wolverine Room.

Dr. Loretta Johns, working with Dr. Patricia Mutch, promises light
refreshments (orange juice and pastry, I think).

Thank you for your interest, and I understand many reasons for those
whose support only extends to part of the package. In any case, our last
formal chance for discussion before the vote will be

Wednesday, January 17, 8:30 - 10:00 in the Wolverine Room of the
cafeteria.

Best wishes for the New Year,
	Malcolm

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Change the Composition of the Board?
Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:14:19 -0500 (EST)

Colleagues,

I'm sorry to take the liberty of addressing a non-GE message to this
list, but because we lack a faculty list, and the issue could be
serious, it seemed reasonable to solicit your input this way.

As a member of the Bylaws Committee of the AU Constituency, I learned
late last week of a proposal to increase the size of the Andrews
University Board of Trustees from 28 to 33, essentially by adding five
presidents of overseas divisions.

Presently the Board breaks down into these categories:
	11 GE members, nominated by the GC
	 8 Lake Union members, likewise officials 
	 9 non-AU, non-officials, primarily laity.

The size of 28 represented a substantial reduction from the previous
level of 45.

Because AU represents about 33% of the constituency delegates, and
perhaps rather more of those who actually attend, as a member of the
Bylaws committee, I'd like to know if I should support the proposed
change, call for further study, or oppose it.

Thank you for any and all advice,
	Malcolm  
	(russell@Andrews.edu)

Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:11:29 -0500 (EST)
From: Patricia Scott 
Subject: Re: Change the Composition of the Board?

Malcom, I don't know enough about the issue, but would question why, if 
the number was reduced from 45 to 28, does anyone want it creeping up 
again?  I rather like the idea of AU  representing 33% of the vote.  Does 
Loma Linda have the  5 presidents on board?  This smacks of politics to 
me, without a good reason behind it. I recognize the Board is a political 
animal, and I am sure you will be sure, as far as is within your power, 
that it be rational as well!  I trust your judgment.

On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Malcolm Russell wrote:

> Colleagues,
> 
> I'm sorry to take the liberty of addressing a non-GE message to this
> list, but because we lack a faculty list, and the issue could be
> serious, it seemed reasonable to solicit your input this way.
> 
> As a member of the Bylaws Committee of the AU Constituency, I learned
> late last week of a proposal to increase the size of the Andrews
> University Board of Trustees from 28 to 33, essentially by adding five
> presidents of overseas divisions.
> 
> Presently the Board breaks down into these categories:
> 	11 GE members, nominated by the GC
> 	 8 Lake Union members, likewise officials 
> 	 9 non-AU, non-officials, primarily laity.
> 
> The size of 28 represented a substantial reduction from the previous
> level of 45.
> 
> Because AU represents about 33% of the constituency delegates, and
> perhaps rather more of those who actually attend, as a member of the
> Bylaws committee, I'd like to know if I should support the proposed
> change, call for further study, or oppose it.
> 
> Thank you for any and all advice,
> 	Malcolm  
> 	(russell@Andrews.edu)
> 



















Date: Tue, 6 Feb 96 07:34:08 EST
From: "" 
Subject: Re: Change the Composition of the Board?

Malcolm--

I suggest that you call for further study of the proposal or request that 
these new members be advisory members only--not voting members.

Delmer

Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 08:41:59 -0500
From: mcbride@andrews.edu (Duane C. McBride)
Subject: Re: Change the Composition of the Board?

I would like to know more of the reasons why the proposal is being made. 
It is to recognize that we are an international GC institution?  Does it
improve our financial and other support base?  Does this change afflect the
influence of other constituences?

Duane McBride

From: "Daniel E. Turk" 
Subject: Re: Change the Composition of the Board?
Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 09:11:43 -0500 (EST)

> Malcolm--
> 
> I suggest that you call for further study of the proposal or request that 
> these new members be advisory members only--not voting members.
> 
> Delmer

I think this is a good idea too.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dan Turk                  turk@acm.org                       Ph.D. Student
(770) 984-2359            turk@gsu.edu             CIS Dept, Georgia State
==========================================================================

Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 09:43:26 -0500 (EST)
From: Neville Webster 
Subject: Re: Change the Composition of the Board?

Malcolm,
Here are some questions we could consider regarding Board size and 
composition:

Efficiency.
I presume the Board was reduced to 28 to save expense and increase 
operating efficiency.  Does a smaller Board really operate better, or is 
efficiency a function of Board leadership, or some other factor?  Will an 
extra five people make any significant difference, other than add expense?

Accountability.
I presume that the purpose of the Board is to govern operations at this 
University.  As such I would also assume that Board membership should be 
accountable to the constituency that Andrews serves.  Thus, all 
stakeholders should be fairly represented and answered to.  While it is 
true that both the GC and the local Union contribute a significant amount 
of money to the University, and are major employers of graduates, it 
would seem that we are bypassing our most important stakeholders - 
students and parents. We also need accountability to other significant 
employer groups.  Does the present Board composition make it possible for 
the University to be held accountable directly to all stakeholder 
groups?  Why should the GC have 11 members, plus a possible 5 more?  For 
that matter, why should there be 19 church administrators, with only 9 
laity?  Does 68 per cent of our funding come from church organizations?

Representativeness.
Closely allied to accountability is the matter of fair representation.  
What is the gender balance?  In a church that was started by really young 
people, how many young persons do we have on the Board?  How many 
students do we have?  In this regard, perhaps some overseas 
representatives would be helpful, but maybe they should be from areas 
that supply the most students.  Are the interests of educators adequately 
represented, or are our Board members primarily interested in pastoral 
issues?

We are living in an era where a large and growing segment of our 
population (constituency) are demanding more accountability and increased 
control over operations that they help fund.  Andrews Board needs to 
reflect these new demands by their constituency.
  

-----------------------------------------------------------
Neville G. Webster, D.Com
Management and Marketing Department.  Phone: (616)471-3107
Andrews University       Berrien Springs  MICH  49104
===========================================================


Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:24:28
From: rshow@andrews.edu
Subject: Re: Change the Composition of the Board?

>Colleagues,
>
>I'm sorry to take the liberty of addressing a non-GE message to this
>list, but because we lack a faculty list, and the issue could be
>serious, it seemed reasonable to solicit your input this way.
>
>As a member of the Bylaws Committee of the AU Constituency, I learned
>late last week of a proposal to increase the size of the Andrews
>University Board of Trustees from 28 to 33, essentially by adding five
>presidents of overseas divisions.
>

Malcolm,

At first glance it seems reasonable to add representation from the world areas 
we serve, especially where we have affiliated schools. However, the size of the 
board was reduced for a reason, and I don't think that reason has changed.

My thinking is, if representation is needed from these other world divisions, 
it should only be done by the replacement of a current position.

Dick Show

rshow@andrews.edu

Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 20:16:31 -0500 (EST)
From: Alice Williams 
Subject: Re: Change the Composition of the Board?

Appreciate the opportunity to have a little bit of input.  Another idea 
that has not been addressed by others is that of conflict of interest.  As I 
recall, one of several reasons for reducing the size of the board was to 
reduce conflict of interest.  Since the division presidents have 
educational institutions within their jurisdiction, I would be concerned 
that their decision-making might be influenced by their other 
responsibilities.  It seems to me that the existing more than one-third 
representation on the board by GC personnel could be structured to include 
more division representation than at present, if that is what the GC 
contingent of the constituency wants.   I don't see any value in 
increasing the size of the board, especially if it changes the 
proportions of membership in this way.  I agree with Neville's observations 
that we do little to encourage input from those who pay the bills for 
tuition and other costs--and their money is a significant portion of our
operating budget.

On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Malcolm Russell wrote:

> Colleagues,
> 
> I'm sorry to take the liberty of addressing a non-GE message to this
> list, but because we lack a faculty list, and the issue could be
> serious, it seemed reasonable to solicit your input this way.
> 
> As a member of the Bylaws Committee of the AU Constituency, I learned
> late last week of a proposal to increase the size of the Andrews
> University Board of Trustees from 28 to 33, essentially by adding five
> presidents of overseas divisions.
> 
> Presently the Board breaks down into these categories:
> 	11 GE members, nominated by the GC
> 	 8 Lake Union members, likewise officials 
> 	 9 non-AU, non-officials, primarily laity.
> 
> The size of 28 represented a substantial reduction from the previous
> level of 45.
> 
> Because AU represents about 33% of the constituency delegates, and
> perhaps rather more of those who actually attend, as a member of the
> Bylaws committee, I'd like to know if I should support the proposed
> change, call for further study, or oppose it.
> 
> Thank you for any and all advice,
> 	Malcolm  
> 	(russell@Andrews.edu)
> 

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Constitutional Proposals for the Constituency
Date: Tue, 13 Feb 1996 07:19:17 -0500 (EST)

Colleagues,

Deep thanks, first of all, to so many of you who responded to my earlier
request for advice about the proposal to add to the Board a net of 5
seats for presidents of overseas divisions.

Based on the evidence that your responses showed at least a great
concern that the issue be considered carefully, Dick Huff has called a
meeting of the Bylaws committee in advance of the Constituency session.

While a fine idea, you will surely agree that a meeting 7:30 in the
morning of the Sunday that the constituency meets presents a number of
difficulties to the careful thought that ought to guide any such
revision of the constitution and bylaws.

In essence, this means that delegates to the constituency can not
consider ahead of time any such proposals. Would there still be a
benefit, though, in having the AU delegates meet together for a broad
consideration of possible issues?

If so, who could organize it?

Thanks for your consideration.
	Malcolm

Date: Tue, 13 Feb 1996 09:14:36 -0500
From: mcbride@andrews.edu (Duane C. McBride)
Subject: Re: Constitutional Proposals for the Constituency

Could a list be posted of the Andrews delegates?  I agree that it would be
great to have the Andrews delegates meet before hand in an informal way to
discuss any issues we have. I agree that our voices are often ineffectual
because we do not know the issues and have not discussed possible
resolutions.  

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Grad Schools of Education Reputational Rankings: 1996 (US News & (fwd)
Date: Wed, 13 Mar 1996 14:26:31 -0500 (EST)

I thought you'd be interested:

>    US News and World Report released its 1996 rankings of
> graduate schools of education in its March 18th issue
> titled America's Best Graduate Schools 1996 Annual Guide.
> Among the various sources of information was the
> reputational ranking by deans and faculty of graduate
> colleges of education. The results appear below, in order
> from highest to lowest with schools alphabetized within
> clusters of tied rankings.
> 
>     Rank    School
>     ____   ____________________________
> 
>      1       Stanford
> 
>      2       Harvard
>      2       Univ Wisconsin-Madison
> 
>      4       Ohio State Univ
>      4       Teachers College Columbia
>      4       Univ Calf-Berkeley
>      4       Univ Illinois-Champaign-Urbana
> 
>      8       Michigan State Univ
>      8       Univ Calf-Los Angeles
>      8       Univ Chicago
>      8       Univ Michigan
>      8       Vanderbilt Univ.
> 
>      13      Indiana Univ
>      13      Univ Minnesota
>      13      Univ Virginia
> 
>      16      Pennsylvania State Univ
>      16      Univ North Carolina
> 
>      20      Univ Arizona
>      20      Univ Georgia
>      20      Univ Texas
>      20      Univ Washington
> 
>      24      Northwestern Univ
>      24      Univ Florida
>      24      Univ Iowa
> 
>      27      Arizona State Univ
>      27      Cornell Univ
>      27      Syracuse Univ
>      27      Univ Kansas
>      27      Univ Colorado-Boulder
>      27      Univ Pennsylvania
> 
>      34      Rutgers
>      34      Texas A&M
>      34      Univ Nebraska-Lincoln
>      34      Univ Southern California
> 
>      40      Boston College
>      40      Florida State Univ
>      40      New York Univ
>      40      SUNY-Buffalo
>      40      Univ Massachusetts
>      40      Univ Missouri-Columbia
> 
> -------**********======================================**********--------
> Gene V Glass                                         glass@asu.edu
> College of Education                                 gvg@asu.edu
> Arizona State University                             602-965-2692
> Box 872411                                           Tempe, AZ 85287-2411
>         World Wide Web Home Page   http://olam.ed.asu.edu/
> 

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: CALL FOR PROPOSALS (fwd)
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 08:42:25 -0400 (EDT)

Colleagues:

F.Y.I.
Forwarded message:

> Sixth Annual Conference of the Institute for The Study of
> Postsecondary Pedagogy
> The School of Education
> The State University of New York at New Paltz
> 
> NOVEMBER 20-22, 1996
> Mohonk Mountain House
> 
> INSTRUCTIONAL TECHNOLOGY, PEDAGOGY AND THE CURRICULUM:
> RETHINKING THE TEACHING AND LEARNING PROCESS
> 
> Instructional technology has been integrated into the curriculum at many
> colleges and universities, creating new interactive learning environments. It
> is heralded by many as a panacea for educational ills and a vital component of
> the postsecondary curriculum, but critiqued by others as simply an "add-on"
> or a subverter of the traditional values of the core curriculum. Regardless of
> the political and ideological divide among some faculty and administrators on
> this issue, instructional technology now plays an inevitable role in educating
> students at the postsecondary level. However, the question of how to use the
> technology most effectively and in what instructional mode and with what course
> content and pedagogy are areas that require more analysis and discussion. Relat
> ed issues include how to use technology to restructure and design courses and
> to evaluate and assess learning. The most critical questions involve how
> technology will change the teaching and learning process, the creation of
> knowledge, and perhaps the very structure of higher education, creating the
> virtual university, the university without walls.
> 
> This conference is designed to explore the broad and complex issues underlying
> the interaction of technology, pedagogy, curriculum, and learning, and to
> stimulate dialogue across disciplines and institutional roles and agendas. The
> Program Committee invites proposals for paper presentations, workshops,
> demonstrations, and roundtables on the suggested topics and issues:
> 
> * Technology and Global Education
> * Designing Courses in Distance Education & Evaluating and Assessing Learning
> * Faculty Development Projects
> * Technology, Social Identity and Values
> * Managment and Union Views of Technology: Collective Antagonism or Bargaining?
> * Changes in Research Paradigms and Pedagogies
> * Social Constructivism and Technology
> * Technology, Equity, Acess, and the Law
> * Technology, Learning Productivity, Eductaional Objectives and Assessment
> * Using the Internet, WWW, and Software in Course Design and Classroom Teaching
> * Creating Distributed/Interactive Learning Environments
> * Applying and Evaluating Multimedia/Hypermedia Systems
> * Curriculum, Pedagogy and Instruction
> * Teaching Writing and Rhetoric Using E-Mail and MOOs
> * Technology and the Construction of Disciplinary Knowledge
> * Authoring and Knowledge-Structuring Tools
> * Computer-Mediated Conferencing/Communictaion
> * Institutional Policy, Intellectual Property and Legal Issues
> * The Virtual University and the Curriculum
> * Technology and the Arts
> * Interdisciplinary Curricula and Applying Technology Across Disciplines
> * Postmodernist Interpretations of Technology/Electronic Texts
> * Assessment, Evaluation and Research Uses of Informational Technology
> * Collaborative Learning Models and Technology
> * Cognition and the Digital Culture
> 
> Abstracts should be 250-300 words, typed and single-spaced and include the
> title and format, name(s) of presenter(s), academic title, department,
> institution, telephone and fax number, and e-mail address. Proposals must be
> postmarked or received by fax no later than JULY 16TH and sent to: The Program
> Committee, Postsecondary Conference, Humanities 110, SUNY at New Paltz,
> New Paltz NY  12561, Fax: 914-257-2799, Tel: 914-257-3590 or e-mail at
> kelderr@npvm.newpaltz.edu.
> 

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Any Volunteers for an Assessment Subcommittee
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 10:48:52 -0400 (EDT)

Colleagues,

Dr. Loretta Johns has asked me to study assessment issues and methods
for the new GE committee. It will mean some work next year, but if you'd
be willing to help, and are interested in a very important issue in
American higher education, please let either her or me know.
	Malcolm

Date: Thu, 30 May 96 14:00:03 EST
From: "" 
Subject: Re: Any Volunteers for an Assessment Subcommittee

Malcolm--

I'm not looking for a job and do not need to be on the assessment sub-
committee, but I do need to keep up to date on what you are proposing so we 
can integrate what we are doing here with the affiliated campuses.  In 
reality, we need to have some dialogue on expectations for the affiliate 
schools so we can get started working on this at the time of the next 
academic audit for each school which will be over the next couple years to 
get to all of them.  By then we will probably only have two or three 
undergraduate schools still with us.  Sometime when you have time this 
summer I would like to discuss this whole situation with you and Loretta.
Thanks for including me on your mailing list.  I appreciate knowing what is 
going on so I will know how to relate to the overseas schools.

Merlene

From: campbels@andrews.edu (Scott Campbell)
Subject: Re: [Req #1257] Web Page on Andrews Listing for students
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 21:19:48 -0400 (EDT)

Done.  Have a great summer Terry!
> 
> To whom ever might read this note.
> 
> I would like my web page listed on the Andrews Web page for students providing my page meets within your specifications for listing student pages.
> 
> Thank-you!
> Terrence L. Dodge Jr.
> dodge@andrews.edu
> 
> 
> 


-- 
Scott Campbell
UNIX Support
Andrews University
Email: campbels@andrews.edu
Web: http://www.andrews.edu/~campbels/

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: US Government Involvement in GE
Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 12:06:35 -0400 (EDT)

 
               CLINTON DEPLOYS VOWELS TO BOSNIA
        Cities of Sjlbvdnzv, Grzny to Be First Recipients
 
 Before an emergency joint session of Congress yesterday, President Clinton
 announced US plans to deploy over 75,000 vowels to the war-torn region of
 Bosnia.  The deployment, the largest of its kind in American history, will
 provide the region with the critically needed letters A,E,I,O and U, and is
 hoped to render countless Bosnian names more pronounceable.

"For six years, we have stood by while names like Ygrjvslhv and Tzlynhr and
 Glrm have been horribly butchered by millions around the world," Clinton said.
 "Today, the United States must finally stand up and say 'Enough.' It is time
 the people of Bosnia finally had some vowels in their incomprehensible words.
 The US is proud to lead the crusade in this noble endeavour."
 
 The deployment, dubbed Operation Vowel Storm by the State Department, is set
 for early next week, with the Adriatic port cities of Sjlbvdnzv and Grzny
 slated to be the first recipients.  Two C-130 transport planes, each carrying
 over 500 24-count boxes of "E's," will fly from Andrews Air Force Base across
 the Atlantic and airdrop the letters over the cities.
 
 Citizens of Grzny and Sjlbvdnzv eagerly await the arrival of the vowels.  "My
 God, I do not think we can last another day," Trszg Grzdnjkln, 44, said.  "I
 have six children and none of them has a name that is understandable to me or
 to anyone else.  Mr. Clinton, please send my poor, wretched family just one
 'E.' Please."
 
 Said Sjlbvdnzv resident Grg Hmphrs, 67: "With just a few key letters, I could
 be George Humphries.  This is my dream."
 
 If the initial airlift is successful, Clinton said the United States will go
 ahead with full-scale vowel deployment, with C-130's airdropping thousands more
 letters over every area of Bosnia.  Other nations are expected to pitch in as
 well, including 10,000 British "A's" and 6,500 Canadian "U's."  Japan, rich in
 A's and O's, was asked to participate, but declined.
 
 "With these valuable letters, the people of war-ravaged Bosnia will be able to
 make some terrific new words," Clinton said.  "It should be very exciting for
 them, and much easier for us to read their maps."
 
 Linguists praise the US's decision to send the vowels.  For decades they have
 struggled with the hard consonants and difficult pronunciation of most Slavic
 words.  "Vowels are crucial to construction of all language," Baylor University
 linguist Noam Frankel said.  "Without them, it would be difficult to utter a
 single word, much less organize a coherent sentence. Please, just don't get me
 started on the moon-man languages they use in those Eastern European
 countries."
 
 According to Frankel, once the Bosnians have vowels, they will be able to
 construct such valuable sentences as: "The potatoes are ready"; "I believe it
 will rain".
 
 The airdrop represents the largest deployment of any letter to a foreign
 country since 1984.  During the summer of that year, the US shipped 92,000
 consonants to Ethiopia, providing cities like Ouaouoaua, Eaoiiuae, and Aao with
 vital, life-giving supplies of L's, S's and T's. The consonant-relief effort
 failed, however, when vast quantities of the letters were intercepted and
 horded by violent, gun-toting warlords.
  

HAVE A HAPPY SUMMER, 
	Malcolm

From: Patricia Scott 
Subject: RE: US Government Involvement in GE
Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 12:17:35 -0400


------ =_NextPart_000_01BB4EEB.29F4A2C0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Malcolm--How very clever.  Haven't had such a good laugh all year.  Many thanks; especially needed it today!

--Patricia Scott

----------
>From: 	Malcolm Russell[SMTP:russell@andrews.edu]
Sent: 	Friday, May 31, 1996 8:06 AM
To: 	ge@andrews.edu
>Subject: 	US Government Involvement in GE

 
               CLINTON DEPLOYS VOWELS TO BOSNIA
        Cities of Sjlbvdnzv, Grzny to Be First Recipients
 
 Before an emergency joint session of Congress yesterday, President Clinton
 announced US plans to deploy over 75,000 vowels to the war-torn region of
 Bosnia.  The deployment, the largest of its kind in American history, will
 provide the region with the critically needed letters A,E,I,O and U, and is
 hoped to render countless Bosnian names more pronounceable.

"For six years, we have stood by while names like Ygrjvslhv and Tzlynhr and
 Glrm have been horribly butchered by millions around the world," Clinton said.
 "Today, the United States must finally stand up and say 'Enough.' It is time
 the people of Bosnia finally had some vowels in their incomprehensible words.
 The US is proud to lead the crusade in this noble endeavour."
 
 The deployment, dubbed Operation Vowel Storm by the State Department, is set
 for early next week, with the Adriatic port cities of Sjlbvdnzv and Grzny
 slated to be the first recipients.  Two C-130 transport planes, each carrying
 over 500 24-count boxes of "E's," will fly from Andrews Air Force Base across
 the Atlantic and airdrop the letters over the cities.
 
 Citizens of Grzny and Sjlbvdnzv eagerly await the arrival of the vowels.  "My
 God, I do not think we can last another day," Trszg Grzdnjkln, 44, said.  "I
 have six children and none of them has a name that is understandable to me or
 to anyone else.  Mr. Clinton, please send my poor, wretched family just one
 'E.' Please."
 
 Said Sjlbvdnzv resident Grg Hmphrs, 67: "With just a few key letters, I could
 be George Humphries.  This is my dream."
 
 If the initial airlift is successful, Clinton said the United States will go
 ahead with full-scale vowel deployment, with C-130's airdropping thousands more
 letters over every area of Bosnia.  Other nations are expected to pitch in as
 well, including 10,000 British "A's" and 6,500 Canadian "U's."  Japan, rich in
 A's and O's, was asked to participate, but declined.
 
 "With these valuable letters, the people of war-ravaged Bosnia will be able to
 make some terrific new words," Clinton said.  "It should be very exciting for
 them, and much easier for us to read their maps."
 
 Linguists praise the US's decision to send the vowels.  For decades they have
 struggled with the hard consonants and difficult pronunciation of most Slavic
 words.  "Vowels are crucial to construction of all language," Baylor University
 linguist Noam Frankel said.  "Without them, it would be difficult to utter a
 single word, much less organize a coherent sentence. Please, just don't get me
 started on the moon-man languages they use in those Eastern European
 countries."
 
 According to Frankel, once the Bosnians have vowels, they will be able to
 construct such valuable sentences as: "The potatoes are ready"; "I believe it
 will rain".
 
 The airdrop represents the largest deployment of any letter to a foreign
 country since 1984.  During the summer of that year, the US shipped 92,000
 consonants to Ethiopia, providing cities like Ouaouoaua, Eaoiiuae, and Aao with
 vital, life-giving supplies of L's, S's and T's. The consonant-relief effort
 failed, however, when vast quantities of the letters were intercepted and
 horded by violent, gun-toting warlords.
  

HAVE A HAPPY SUMMER, 
	Malcolm




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Date: Fri, 31 May 96 11:27:14 EST
From: "" 
Subject: Re: US Government Involvement in GE

Malcolm--

Thanks for the Clinton pronouncement.  It was great!  Perhaps you could get 
him to deploy a few vowels for you to take to the Middle East!  At least 
you might know better what to do with them!  Have a great trip and I hope 
the computer will work well for you.

Merlene

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: What Adventism is GE to teach?
Date: Thu, 22 Aug 1996 10:15:37 -0400 (EDT)

Colleagues,

I'm troubled by the following news story for two reasons. The first, why
the denomination should be attempting to sell such books to the public,
need not delay us. But at a time when there are increasing pressures on
SDA colleges and universities to reflect Adventist doctrines, it prompts
the question "Just what SDA viewpoints are we to propound?"

We may have a real swamp blocking our future.
	Malcolm
 
                             RICHMOND TIMES-DISPATCH
                  Copyright (c) 1996, Richmond Newspapers, Inc.
 
                          DATE: Sunday, August 11, 1996
                                 TAG: 9608110220
                                    PAGE: B-4
                                EDITION: One Star
                                 SECTION: General
                                 LENGTH: 85 lines
                                ILLUSTRATION: NONE
                 SOURCE: By Jan Cienski, Associated Press Writer
              MEMO: (lcs) Shorter version in City Edition, page B-4
 
     ------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
                             BOOK SPURS DENUNCIATIONS
                SEVENTH-DAY ADVENTISTS PUBLISH ATTACK ON THE POPE
 
     Roman Catholics and some Protestants are denouncing a book published by
     a major Protestant evangelical denomination that claims the pope is in
     league with the devil.
 
     The book, "God's Answers to Your Questions," likens the papacy to the
     beast in the book of Revelation -- an ally of Satan in the world's final
     days.
 
     The book is published and distributed nationally, door-to-door, by the
     Seventh-day Adventist Church.
 
     "That the seventh head (of the beast) represents Antichrist, or the
     papacy, there can be little doubt," the book asserts.
 
     The book's conclusions have no biblical basis, said Catholic clergy and
     lay officials and a Protestant Bible scholar.
 
     William Donohue, president of the Catholic League for Religious and
     Civil Rights in New York, said he often sees anti-Catholic literature
     but was surprised to see it coming from a major denomination.
 
     "For this to come from the Seventh-day Adventists and not from a
     splinter group makes this offense particularly egregious," he said.
     "This raises the ante and makes it all the more serious."
 
     Sister Mary Ann Walsh, spokeswoman for the United States Catholic
     Conference, called the book "typical anti-Catholic bigotry."
 
     Sibley Towner, professor of biblical interpretation at Union Theological
     Seminary, a Presbyterian institution in Richmond, said he was surprised
     the Adventists published the book. "It's outrageous and inflammatory and
     untrue biblically in any sense."
 
     George Reid, head of the Biblical Research Institute of the Seventh-day
     Adventist Church, said the book merely follows the lead of such
     Protestant reformers as Martin Luther and John Calvin.
 
     "We still believe that it's the reasonable way to understand these
     prophecies, arising from the text itself and not political correctness,"
     he said.
 
     The Seventh-day Adventist Church is based in Silver Spring, Md.  The
     church traces its origins to William Miller of New Hampton, N.Y., who
     predicted that the world would end in the 1840s. The church says it has
     9 million members worldwide.
 
     The book is published by the Review and Herald Publishing Association in
     Hagerstown, Md., one of the denomination's main publishing houses.
 
     Richard Coffen, vice president for editorial services at the publishing
     house, said he did not know how many copies of the book had been
     distributed.
 
     Coffen said the book was a critique, not bigotry, and that it attacks
     the papacy, not specific popes. "Our position is that we are criticizing
     the system and not individual Catholic Christians."
 
     Donohue said he has heard that argument before.
 
     "It's like saying to children, 'I hate your father and I hate your
     mother, but I don't hate you.' "
 
     The book says those who follow papal teachings are Satan's allies.
 
     "Those who acknowledge the supremacy of the beast by yielding obedience
     to the law of God as changed and enforced by the papacy . . . worship
     the beast. . . . Such will take the side of Satan in his rebellion
     against God's authority," the book says.
 
     Linking the pope to the Antichrist springs from the days of the
     Reformation 500 years ago when new Protestant churches were battling
     Roman Catholics, Towner said.
 
     "In the Reformation, Protestants threw the word Antichrist around a
     lot," he said. "But that has not been done in mainline Protestant
     circles for centuries."
 
     Anti-Catholic language these days usually comes from small sectarian
     groups affiliated with right-wing political causes such as the Ku Klux
     Klan, Towner said.
 
     The book comes at a time when relations between evangelical Christians
     and Catholics have been improving. In 1994, Southern Baptists, the
     country's largest Protestant denomination, and the Catholic Church
     endorsed a dialogue between the two denominations.
 
     The Christian Coalition also has been trying to build ties to socially
     conservative Catholics.
 
     "There have been a number of attempts to build political coalitions
     between Catholics and conservative Protestants," said William Dinges,
     professor of religious studies at the Catholic University of America in
     Washington. "Conservative Catholics who would move to the right on
     cultural issues might be offended by this."
 
     Donohue said he doubts the book will influence anyone, but it concerns
     him nonetheless.   "This kind of anti-Catholicism cannot be discounted,"
     he said. "It's affecting the Joe Sixpacks of this world, and these
     people are not unimportant, and it has to be taken seriously."
 
 (submitted by Jim, dunn@andrews.edu)
 
> 
> 

Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 10:41:04 -0400
From: mcbride@andrews.edu (Duane C. McBride)
Subject: Re: What Adventism is GE to teach?

I have always been surprised that given the wide spread distribution of
this book that we have not gotten more of this type of coverage.  We
probably do need to think carefully about what "beast" is in principle and
in specific application and how we communicate it.

I did learn something very new from the article.  I never knew that our
target audience for the Great Controversy was heavy drinking males.  I
wonder if the SDA publishing houses are aware of this?

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Petitioning Science Areas
Date: Sun, 15 Sep 1996 08:28:59 -0400 (EDT)

At the advisors' meeting last week, someone wisely suggested that we use
this forum to address questions about transfer students' credits
applying to General Education.

Here's the first example I came across:

Student who came to AU last year, as a transfer student with gpa > 3.0.
High school courses in chemistry, biology, and physics.

Will 12 credits in Physics for Scientists .. by itself satisfy the new
GE requirements?  
	against: just one area
	for: a most challenging course.
	for: high school areas included biology and physics, and 
		the reductions we've been making apply in this case.

Note: the breadth requirements can presumably met by this non-science
major by courses in the humanities and social sciences, with courses
already taken.
	Malcolm Russell

From: "G. William Mutch" 
Date: Mon, 16 Sep 96 16:28:48 EST
Subject: Re: Petitioning Science Areas

Malcolm et al:

Since the student enrolled at Andrews last year, is under the 1995/96 
bulletin, and presented 3 units of high school science, which would reduce 
the natural science requirement to 8 credits, taking the Physics for 
Scientists and Engineers course would complete the Natural Science GE
requirement.

For students required to complete 8 credits, they must end up with courses 
in all three areas on the high school and/or college level.  This 
requirement has been met.

Since I don't agree with the course reduction philosophy, I would prefer 
that the person take course work in two areas and with the background 
presented the course work should be at the majors level rather than at the 
introductory level.

Fortunately, that system is ending next year and the level of performance 
expected of our students will increase.  This is a move in the right 
direction if Andrews is indeed to become a 'Notre Dame' for the SDA 
church.  Students who perform to high expectations are in high demand and 
we should be working to fill that demand.

Cheers.
***********************************************************************
* G. William Mutch                Phone: (616) 471-3248 (voice mail)  *
* Department of Chemistry & Biochemistry         Fax: (616) 471-6396  *
* Andrews University                      E-Mail:  mutch@andrews.edu  *
* Berrien Springs, MI  49104-0430                                     *
***********************************************************************

From: Patricia Scott 
Subject: RE: Petitioning Science Areas
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 08:44:06 -0400


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Glad this forum is working.  I've had two answers already from the =
limited submitted so far.

Another question:   Do students who come in as juniors (as in our RN to =
BS) have to take the philosophy of service course?  Won't it be hard to =
get them in?
I urgently need to know the answer as we have them registering now.

Patricia Scott
Nursing
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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 09:58:48 +0100
From: mcbride@andrews.edu (Duane C. McBride)
Subject: RE: Petitioning Science Areas

I think we would try to make sure there is room even if we have to have
more sections, but as to the requirement I do not think they have to, right
Loretta?

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: SERVICE FOR TRANSFER STUDENTS
Date: Thu, 19 Sep 1996 09:58:12 -0400 (EDT)

Colleagues,

Due to the theft this summer of her computer, Loretta Johns does not
have good access to e-mail and the GE list serve yet. She's therefore
asked me to send along the following message:

Subject: none

No Service Requirements for sophomores-seniors using the 1996-97
Bulletin.

After consulting with faculty involved, it appears that we lack
sufficient space in our courses for transfer students and AU students in
the sophomore through senior years who may elect to use the 1996-97
Bulletin. As a result, 

1). Sophomores through seniors using the 1996-97 Bulletin do not need to
take Philosophy of Service (2 credits).

2). Actual service is also cancelled, as we expected it would be,
because it has not yet been incorporated into courses in the various
majors.

We are trying to repeat this message over voice mail, and please notify
any of your advisees who may be affected. We will announce it in class.

Thanks for your attention, and your patience as we work out these
changes.
	Malcolm

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: UPDATE: GE for Transfer Students
Date: Fri, 20 Sep 1996 09:18:19 -0400 (EDT)

Colleagues,

Apparently the message I attempted to send for Loretta yesterday did not
work. Here's a new attempt:

SERVICE REQUIREMENT WAIVED FOR SOPHOMORES THROUGH SENIORS at first
registration, 1996-97.

It looks like all incoming freshmen will fill all sections of the
Philosophy for Service course. Therefore, this year, both transfer
students and current AU students who elect to use the 1996-97 Bulletin
will be waived from the entire service requirement provided they are
sophomores or above at first registration this year. This applies to
both the Philosophy for Service course and the service experience.

MODERN LANGUAGE REQUIREMENTS FOR CONTINUING AU STUDENTS
(BA)

In the logical cause of greater efficiency, the Modern Languages
Department only offers elementary and intermediate courses according to
the new GE requirements. These are organized as elementary (4-4-4) and
intermediate (3-3).

Returning AU students who need to satisfy the BA requirements find that
they can not use just three courses; seniors, for example, can not
longer satisfy the requirements in just three quarters.

We can't require either more credits or more quarters out of students
under previous Bulletins. Therefore, students under previous Bulletins
may satisfy their foreign language requirements with three quarters of
elementary foreign language, rather than the complete package.

Thanks for taking the time to read this, and please pass along the
information to colleagues who may be interested but to not subscribe to
GE.

(Prepared and transmitted for Dr. Loretta Johns, GE Director, whose
e-mail links are not fully restored after the theft of her office
computer).
	Malcolm

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Clarification of Religion Options
Date: Fri, 20 Sep 1996 10:35:38 -0400 (EDT)

In answer to an advisor's question:

Transfer students and AU students electing the new GE requirements will
need to use existing religion courses this year if they've already had a
college religion course.

Any typical GE options should work. We will arrange an automatic waiver
of the specific religion requirements for them.

(Just another reason the GE committee wished to apply the new GE just to
freshmen, 1996-97, but it's water over the dam).

Thanks,
	Malcolm

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Invitation to join GE Subcommittees
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996 16:10:48 -0400 (EDT)

Subject: none

This is an invitation to serve on one (or more, if you have the time and
interest) of the General Education Subcommittees. Here's the list of the
committees; please contact the chair directly by October 2.

Arts, Humanities & Religion (Gary Land)
Assessment (Malcolm Russell)
Language and Communication (Delmer Davis -new phone is 3173)
Social Sciences, Wellness & Service (Duane McBride)
Math, Computing & Natural Science (Ray Paden)

We particularly encourage professors from other departments to join
subcommittees to represent the consumers of the courses in an area. That
will help avoid the subcommittees becoming too committed to the interests
of the disciplines involved.

	Malcolm

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Attracting Bad Luck
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996 16:15:24 -0400 (EDT)

 Do some students attract bad luck?
 
 Yesterday an upper-division ACT scholarship recipient came to see me
 because the GPA had fallen below the required 3.25 level to receive the
 scholarship.
 
 Last year the student took Phys. of Sci, Quantitative Analysis,
 Sophomore Algebra, and Organic Chemistry, the resulting total causing
 the GPA to dip.
 
 Result: faced with burnout, the student selected a new major.
 
 However, the new
 advisor prescribed the introductory, freshmen-level course plus
 two upper division courses (one of them requiring the freshman course as
 a prerequisite). This for a student who had incentives of $ 2,000 /yr to
 earn at least a 3.5 gpa and qualify again for the scholarship.
 
 Should we raise our eyebrows at students, and advisors, who seem to go
 from one difficulty to the next?
 	Malcolm
 
 

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 1996 14:29:59 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Ronald L. Johnson" 
Subject: Re: Invitation to join GE Subcommittees

I would be interested in working on the assessment subcommittee.

Thanks,
Ron Johnson (ENGR)

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Re: Invitation to join GE Subcommittees
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 1996 15:40:49 -0400 (EDT)

Ron,

Wonderful. We'll desperately need the common-sense!
	Malcolm
	> 
> I would be interested in working on the assessment subcommittee.
> 
> Thanks,
> Ron Johnson (ENGR)
> 

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Folkenberg Calls for Total Individual Committment to God
Date: Wed, 2 Oct 1996 11:48:03 -0400 (EDT)

Forwarded message:
 
 COSTA RICA HOSTS SEVENTH-DAY ADVENTIST CHURCH
 WORLD COUNCIL
 
 San Jose, Costa Rica... [ANN] An appeal for a "Total Commitment to God"
 by the world leader of the Seventh-day Adventist Church, Robert S.
 Folkenberg, opened the church's world Annual Council being held at the
 Hotel Herradura Resort and Conference Center in San Jose, Costa Rica, on
 October 1.  
      Referring to a key agenda item of the council, Folkenberg described
 it as "a pastoral call for every element of our church: every member, every
 employee, every institution and every church organization" to demonstrate a
 "Total Commitment to God."  
      He said that Seventh-day Adventists are "to be systematically and
 appropriately accountable for our individual spiritual growth; for the
 spiritual and numerical growth of every congregation; and to develop
 spiritual master plans and assessment programs so each organization and
 institution will be more likely to achieve its basic Christian objectives." 
      Folkenberg explained that this proposal attempts to "unite the beliefs
 and values that define this [Adventist] movement, that we enshroud in our
 Mission Statements, policies and fundamental beliefs, with the realities of
 life as we live it both individually and organizationally. This proposal calls
 for increased accountability within the church to meet God's expectations,"
 he stated.
 
A transcript of the keynote address by Robert S. Folkenberg, General Conference
president, is available on Adventist On-line the Seventh-day Adventist forum on
CompuServe.



From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: You might enjoy this... Training vs. Education
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1996 09:58:26 -0400 (EDT)

I thought you might appreciate this 
	Malcolm
	
> Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 20:28:02 -0500 (EST)
> From: MITCH@UMBC2.UMBC.EDU
> Subject: EH.T: Education vs. Training (x Eductech)

> The following is forwarded from an electronic think
> tank  called "eductech" that has just started up on
> the role of technology in education.  Some may find
> the distinction offered between education and training to
> be of interest.
> ****************************************************
> 
 
 EDUCATION VS TRAINING 
 Michael J Robson 
 University of Zimbabwe
 1/10/96
 
 All  my  life I have been in Education, but I was not  so  stupid 
 that I didn't try to escape from time to time. For example, there 
 was the time that a Vice President of  some big corporation  said 
 to  me:  "Mike, get out of Education, get into  Training,  that's 
 where  the real money lies. I'll introduce you to a bloke I  know 
 on  the Training side".  So I get to meet this  Trainer.  Picture 
 me,  very  down at heel, torn cuffs, vaguely  redolent  of  chalk 
 dust,  an  Educator, you know. Picture the Trainer,  brief  case, 
 company car, sharp new suit, very brisk and efficient, a Trainer, 
 see?   "So  tell  me", I said, "What exactly  is  the  difference 
 between  Education  and  Training?"  "Very  simple"  he  replied.  
 "Education  is  a form of training in which  the  Objectives  are 
 unclear."
 
 I  never  did  get to join them. But I  have  moved  in  Training 
 circles,  and I am able to tell you that it is  different  there.  
 They have no broken furniture. The equipment works. You can  even 
 write  on  the blackboard. And they speak a  different  language.  
 "Sorry, you can't see Mr  Mamvura, he's Training right now.  (Not 
 teaching,  see, he's TRAINING. Teaching is a very dirty  word  in 
 training  circles.  Teachers  don't know  what  they  are  doing; 
 Trainers do.) 
 
 So  my suggestion is that in our discussion we should try  to  be 
 very  clear at all times whether we are talking about  Education, 
 or  whether  we are talking about Training. As I  understand  it, 
 Training is relatively simple. You have a Trainer, who knows  how 
 to do something, and you have a Trainee, who doesn't. The Trainer 
 specifies  exactly  what  the Trainee will be able  to  DO,  once 
 trained.  He specifies some objective test by which  the  Trainee 
 will  reveal  whether or not he can do it yet. Then  the  Trainer 
 devises some package of experiences, and sets up a training loop: 
 input-test-revise  the package. Given a plentiful supply  of  co-
 operative  Trainees  of similar initial ability, we soon  have  a 
 finely  honed  training package which can bring about  a  desired 
 change at a known cost within a specified time. 
 
 So  training is relatively easy, it actually works, all it  takes 
 is  a  suitcase full of money, and it can be vastly  improved  by 
 applying the new technology.  No doubt in our discussion we  will 
 be  talking  a  lot about the application of  new  technology  to 
 training. 
 
 What about Education?  Quoted in today's Harare newspaper here is 
 the  Zimbabwean  Minister  for  Education  presaging  changes  in 
 education: "...aimed at producing citizens that are  hardworking, 
 honest  and  patriotic [also]  creative,  inventive,  innovative, 
 responsible,  resourceful, resilient,  trustworthy,  accountable, 
 problem  solving, tactical and strategic". Teachers must  aim  to 
 [develop   in  students]  "friendliness,  approachability,    and 
 reliability"  ;  their products must be able to  "develop,  plan, 
 organise  and  manage relevant  organisations,  institutions  and 
 other  sectors  of  the  economy". No wonder  that  we  all  find 
 Education so much more difficult than Training. Trainers transmit 
 skills  which they already have. Teachers are asked  to  transmit 
 skills which they don't have. 
 
 Clearly,  education  is a form of Training in  which  the  target 
 skill is not yet widely available, or even not yet invented.  For 
 example,  when  I went to school, there were no  such  things  as 
 computers   (well,  not  generally  available,  anyway.)  So   my 
 teachers, who had never even heard of computers, had the task  of  
 teaching  me  so  that when computers  (and  anything  else)  got 
 invented, I would be able to master them. 
 
 So  Training  is about existing skills, and  Education  is  about 
 skills still in the future. 
 

From: campbels@andrews.edu (Scott Campbell)
Subject: Disk Usage
Date: Sun, 3 Nov 1996 01:07:46 -0500 (EST)

The following people are over their disk quotas.  Many of you had quotas
of 10M, but infortunately the number of users increases as time
progresses.  I am asking that we try to get the disk usage down to about
5M.  Tonight, the partitions that your accounts exist on are full.  I
will try to free up as much space as I can, but I need your help....
Thanks.
Scott

 8910   phelan
 8718   ndege
 8567   bowen
 5859   ko
13857   yuansc
 9872   andriam
 9505   chenp
 8792   ninan
 7235   wangc
 6334   leo
 6209   wiemers
 6130   guo
-- 
             Scott Campbell
    Computer Science Dept. Supervisor
|----------Andrews University------------|
|Phone: 616-471-3516                     |
|Email: campbels@andrews.edu             |
|Web:   http://www.andrews.edu/~campbels/|
|----------------------------------------|

From: Patricia Scott 
Subject: Undergraduate Policies:  Admission
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 07:13:35 -0500

The sub-subcommittee looking at the admissions section of the =
Undergraduate Policy Manual (pp. 1-18, Section I) welcomes your advice, =
thoughts, opinions, whatever.  If you have specific concerns, either =
with policies or with the bulletin where the policies should be =
reflected,  please drop us a line. =20
 =20
So far we have concentrated on shortening and simplifying.  In the =
process, we've hit the nitty-gritty philosophical questions, which need =
answering before we can proceed.   This list is by no means complete; =
please feel free to add to it, as well as to enlighten us with your =
accumulated wisdom.

	1.  In light of AU's mission,  what is our philosophical stance on the =
pursuit of excellence on this campus?  What one or two things do we want =
to be known for?  (Peters, et al.)  How does this relate to admissions?  =
How can we maintain a balance between giving a "fair chance at a slice =
of the pie" and spending a disproportionate amount of increasingly =
scarce resources (teacher time and everybody's  money) on those who are =
not progressing adequately?

	2.  Are upper division credits a quantitative concern?  Graduation =
requirements are 15 credits of a major, 3 of a minor, in  upper division =
course work.   Is there any relationship between quality and quantity in =
upper division/lower division credit ratios?=20

	3. How do we feel about requiring lower standards for associate degree =
students than we do for BA/BS graduates?  Is there a fundamental =
difference in quality as well as quantity  in a two-year program?=20

	4.  Is there a basic difference in the kind, quality and quantity of =
education provided at a university vs a community or four-year liberal =
arts college?=20

	5.  What exactly does residency mean, now that courses and classes are =
increasingly being offered  in a variety of ways, including HSI, which =
may or may not require the students' physical presence on campus in =
Berrien Springs ?

All advice and counsel  on undergraduate policy is most welcome.  It =
doesn't have to be on our immediate agenda for us to sit up and take =
notice.

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Re: Undergraduate Policies:  Admission
Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 12:42:46 -0500 (EST)

Patricia,

Here are some quick responses:
> 
> The sub-subcommittee looking at the admissions section of the =
> Undergraduate Policy Manual (pp. 1-18, Section I) welcomes your advice, =
> thoughts, opinions, whatever.  If you have specific concerns, either =
> with policies or with the bulletin where the policies should be =
> reflected,  please drop us a line. =20
>  =20
> So far we have concentrated on shortening and simplifying.  In the =
> process, we've hit the nitty-gritty philosophical questions, which need =
> answering before we can proceed.   This list is by no means complete; =
> please feel free to add to it, as well as to enlighten us with your =
> accumulated wisdom.
	Have you addressed the fundamental question of what we use our
	admission requirements for. Are they to obtain students whose
	values and abilities make AU a better place? 
	
	Or are they simply a set of conditions that create a legal
	right?
	
	Personally I'd favor more Bulletin space about what sorts of
	values and educational backgrounds are considered useful for
	incoming students to bring with them, and much less about how
	low we go on the ACT. In fact, we're not a public university. We
	don't have to establish a minimum. We can simply accept a
	particular number, and reject others.

	wheaton College says it looks for 500 to enter the freshman
	class, and those who've succeeded at Wheaton have had these
	characteristics....   BTW, your committee really needs copies of
	their Bulletin as well as a half-dozen other fine Christian
	schools.

> 	1.  In light of AU's mission,  what is our philosophical stance on the =
> pursuit of excellence on this campus? 
	If this weren't meaningless mumbo-jumbo spouted by almost every
	institution in America, we'd probably be liable for fraud when
	we claim we strive for excellence. Individually many of us wowrk
	hard for it; collectively we do almost nothing towards it. We
	accept individuals who have no chance at ever becoming excellent
	students. We promote faculty with only cursosry regard to
	excellence, and fail to devote collective time to the discussion
	of excellence.
	
	Sorry--but you asked what we thought... 
> Wha  one or two things do we want =
> to be known for?  (Peters, et al.) 
	On this--see the mission statement. Which is little or no help.
> How does this relate to admissions?  =
> How can we maintain a balance between giving a "fair chance at a slice =
> of the pie" and spending a disproportionate amount of increasingly =
> scarce resources (teacher time and everybody's  money) on those who are =
> not progressing adequately?
	We can't. And if we really pursued excellence, we'd admit it.
	> 
> 	2.  Are upper division credits a quantitative concern?  Graduation =
> requirements are 15 credits of a major, 3 of a minor, in  upper division =
> course work.   Is there any relationship between quality and quantity in =
> upper division/lower division credit ratios?=20
	What's the relationship here to admission?
	There's little apparent standardization between upper and lower
	division credits on this campus. Just remember that Organic
	Chemistry is a sophomore course...
	
	Furthermore, some courses are 300-level chiefly to make sure
	they are taken here rather than at a community college? Perhaps?
	
	> 
> 	3. How do we feel about requiring lower standards for associate degree =
> students than we do for BA/BS graduates?  Is there a fundamental =
> difference in quality as well as quantity  in a two-year program?=20
	Fine--just admit them to something besides Andrews University.
	It's hopeless to have two admission standards, and a campus life
	that ought to address the needs of all students but can not
	bridge the gap.
	
	> 
> 	4.  Is there a basic difference in the kind, quality and quantity of =
> education provided at a university vs a community or four-year liberal =
> arts college?=20
	There's a large literature on this one. BTW, which are we trying
	to replicate?
	> 
> 	5.  What exactly does residency mean, now that courses and classes are =
> increasingly being offered  in a variety of ways, including HSI, which =
> may or may not require the students' physical presence on campus in =
> Berrien Springs ?
	HSI will be included in residency, I believe.
	> 
> All advice and counsel  on undergraduate policy is most welcome.  It =
> doesn't have to be on our immediate agenda for us to sit up and take =
> notice.

	Patricia,
	
	I've endeavored to convert others to the view that if we explain
	why we think we need higher standards, and phase them in
	gradually, we might avoid a serious drop in enrollment. Because:
	
	1). We could give academies and students time to prepare better
	for college, and
	
	2). We might attract some students to a more rigorous-admission
	campus that would not come to what we've got now. We could grab
	the "quality" label.
	
	Some current issues:
	1). Are students informed about what faculty expect of them?
	I've had 25% absences frequently in my sophomore course, and
	most of those who miss are those who most need all available
	help. Some even have the nerve to ask for it outside class when
	they skipped it....
	
		This really questions the nature of freshman
		orientation.
		
	2). We've got assessment issues galore. 
	3). Personally I'd like to see better opportunities for students
	with ability to test out of subjects. More than one student has
	complained to me about required courses not being any more
	difficult than something in HS. In fact, one student submitted
	virbatum HS compositions for college compositions, and received
	As. The English department may not think that's a serious
	problem--but students do, when the course cost $700 or whatever.
	
	4). Evaluation of faculty for promotion and tenure. We've got
	four different schools doing it for undergraduate faculty: are
	the criteria similar?
	
	Do promotion and tenure processes motivate faculty to teach well
	and do research?
	
	Sorry to have gone on,
		Malcolm
		> 

Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 11:52:10 -0500 (EST)
From: Alice Williams 
Subject: Re: Undergraduate Policies: Admission

I shouldn't have read Malcolm's reply before planning my own!  I hope I'm 
not redundant or influenced!

On Mon, 18 Nov 1996, Patricia Scott wrote:

> The sub-subcommittee looking at the admissions section of the Undergraduate Policy Manual (pp. 1-18, Section I) welcomes your advice, thoughts, opinions, whatever.  If you have specific concerns, either with policies or with the bulletin where the policies should be reflected,  please drop us a line.  
>   
> So far we have concentrated on shortening and simplifying.  In the process, we've hit the nitty-gritty philosophical questions, which need answering before we can proceed.   This list is by no means complete; please feel free to add to it, as well as to enlighten us with your accumulated wisdom.
> 
> 	1.  In light of AU's mission,  what is our philosophical stance on the pursuit of excellence on this campus?  What one or two things do we want to be known for?  (Peters, et al.)  How does this relate to admissions?  How can we maintain a balance between giving a "fair chance at a slice of the pie" and spending a disproportionate amount of increasingly scarce resources (teacher time and everybody's  money) on those who are not progressing adequately?
> 
	I just grabbed the Bulletins to review the mission statement--and 
it's not there, which tells me a lot about how important it is 
considered--we don't even feel we need to communicate it to undergraduate 
students.  When I found it in the graduate bulletin, it seems fulled with 
high-sounding general statements not unlike what any SDA college or 
university would say about themselves.  Nothing very specific or 
measureable.  My presently cynical attitude is that many AU personnel 
know what they mean by excellence (some share those ideas fluently, but 
apparently not convincingly), but we do not have a corporate, 
mutually owned sense of either the kind of student we want to admit or 
the kind of graduate we want to send out.  

	In addition, we have a collective multiple personality disorder 
with the whole issue of what kind of student we should recruit.  This 
applies not only in terms of academic excellence, but also in terms of 
basic Christian and SDA belief systems.  Students have arrived here, 
sometimes from abroad, with little understanding of what it means to live 
on a campus where smoking and alcohol/drug consumption are forbidden.  
THis creates problems in the dorms and classroom that go way beyond the 
periodic concerns about whether most jewelry should be forbidden so that 
the visitor to our campus will feel that we "look Adventist."

> 	2.  Are upper division credits a quantitative concern?  Graduation requirements are 15 credits of a major, 3 of a minor, in  upper division course work.   Is there any relationship between quality and quantity in upper division/lower division credit ratios? 

	I like the idea of requiring a specific quantity of upper 
division credits overall and in the major, but I'm not sure that I can 
articulate why.  I do agree with Malcolm that it should mean something 
more than an inducement to take the course at AU rather than elsewhere.  
My opinion is colored by belonging to a profession where virtually all the 
professional coursework is taught on an upper division level, so the 
question is nearly moot.

> 	3. How do we feel about requiring lower standards for associate degree students than we do for BA/BS graduates?  Is there a fundamental difference in quality as well as quantity  in a two-year program? 

	No easy answers here and at present those schools (school?) 
choosing to offer associate degrees are best qualified to make this 
determination.  Where it impacts the rest of us is in general education 
courses.  That raises the whole issue of whether an associate degree is 
more of a technician program that perhaps could or should have different 
general education requirements.  Again, the first question may be what 
kind of product (graduate) we want to send out.  Then, what kind of 
program will we offer to get that product.  Finally (this seems backwards, 
doesn't it?) what kind of student do we need to admit for the 
treatment/program to work.

> 	4.  Is there a basic difference in the kind, quality and quantity of education provided at a university vs a community or four-year liberal arts college? 
> 
	OF course.  But agreeing as a group (faculty, recruitment 
personnel, student services personnel) on what we mean and how to 
implement is the current challenge.

> 	5.  What exactly does residency mean, now that courses and classes are increasingly being offered  in a variety of ways, including HSI, which may or may not require the students' physical presence on campus in Berrien Springs ?
> 
	This can still be defined however we want to define it so that 
the goal is met.  In my mind, that goal is some control over the 
characteristics or qualifications of the "product" or graduate.  I think 
that the whole point of residency requirements is one of quality 
control--we want to be able to say, as a faculty, that we can stand by a 
product (i.e., graduate) of a consistent quality with specific 
characteristics (e.g., dietitians trained at AU will have a significant level 
of understanding about vegetarian nutrition).  We feel that we cannot do 
this when too much of the learning has taken place elsewhere.  Sometimes 
the quality of training obtained elsewhere may exceed ours, but it still 
isn't the unique blend of characteristics we hoped to instill in "our" 
graduates.

> All advice and counsel  on undergraduate policy is most welcome.  It doesn't have to be on our immediate agenda for us to sit up and take notice.
> 
	I have very strong feelings about the relationships among campus 
entities (e.g., academic, student services, recruitment and financial 
aid, etc.).  We can set all the policies we want to, but if we do not all 
agree on what kind of student to bring here and what we hope they "look" 
like when they leave, we will continue to function at cross purposes, 
obtaining too many students who cannot function in this environment and 
graduating too many who are so angry about what happened to them here 
that they do not donate or recruit for us as alumni.

This is longer than I intended, but the work of this subcommittee affects 
more than the academic side of campus.  I appreciate the opportunity to 
have imput.

Alice Williams
Department of Nutrition

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Pitzer on Steinberg, _Beyond the Classroom_ (fwd)
Date: Wed, 4 Dec 1996 07:28:59 -0500 (EST)

I thought some of us might find this interesting...
	Malcolm
	
	Forwarded message:
> 
> H-NET BOOK REVIEW
> Published by H-High-S@msu.edu  (September 1996)
> 
> Laurence Steinberg, _Beyond the Classroom: Why School Reform Has
> Failed and What Parents Need to Do_.  New York: Simon and Schuster,
> 1996.  194 pp.  Appendix, notes, bibliography, and index. $22.00
> (cloth), ISBN 0-684-80008-X.
> 
> Reviewed for H-High-S by Paul C. Pitzer, Aloha High School,
> Beaverton, Oregon 
> 
> Laurence Steinberg, a psychologist at Temple University, Bradford
> Brown of the University of Wisconsin--Madison, and Sanford M.
> Dornbusch of Stanford University have produced a long overdue study
> documenting the failure of expensive reform efforts in American
> primary and especially secondary schools.  This relatively short
> work, written for both the lay person and the professional educator,
> addresses and answers a number of troublesome questions, including:
> What went wrong with school reform efforts?  Why are so many
> students disengaged from the learning process?  Whose fault is it?
> What can teachers and parents do about it?
> 
> Steinberg and his associates do not shy away from potentially
> explosive areas.  Why do Asian-American students do well while
> African-American and Hispanic students perform poorly?  The answer
> is not intelligence.  Extensive interviews and detailed research
> among a variety of students indicates the significant role of
> parents, peers, and jobs, and the occasional and minimal influence
> of teachers and schools.
> 
> In the first two chapters, the authors clearly identify the problem
> and produce evidence that American society is generally denying its
> failure satisfactorily to educate young people, especially
> teenagers.  Compounding the problems of this denial is the habit of
> placing the blame directly on the schools and the teachers rather
> than on society as a whole.  Students today, they explain, still
> understand the need to graduate from high school, but as a group
> they see no need to work hard at it, or strive for high grades.  An
> average of four hours a week is spent by American students on
> homework, compared with the four hours of study accomplished daily
> by their counterparts in the rest of the industrialized world.
> 
> In discussing "disengaged students," the authors point out that not
> only must schools present an interesting program, an emphasis of
> most well- intentioned reform efforts, but that students must be
> "...willing and able to be interested" (p. 63).  One-third of
> students in the study admitted that they did none of the assigned
> homework.  In response, teachers have been forced to "dumb down"
> classes.  In emphasizing this point, the authors cite the phenomenon
> of _Dumb and Dumber_ and the recent proliferation of films and
> television programs glorifying stupidity.  Given the opportunity,
> today's students will drop to the lowest achievement level possible
> to qualify for graduation.  Lowering the standards of failure
> encourages students to lower their own performance level.  It is
> shocking to realize that tests clearly show student intelligence
> rising while SAT and other test scores continue to decline
> precipitously.
> 
> Chapters six and seven examine four styles of parenting:
> authoritative (preferred), authoritarian, permissive, and not
> involved (least desirable).  The studies showed that in all
> households, the authoritative style, in which set rules and
> individual responsibility co-exist and complement one another, helps
> children perform better in school with greater regularity.  However,
> chapter eight reveals the results of studies indicating that peer
> pressure can undermine even the best efforts of the most concerned
> parents.  For many students, this unrelenting peer pressure
> discourages any effort to do more than simply get by in school.
> 
> Chapter nine presents yet another difficulty to be considered.
> American students work too many hours to allow them time to
> concentrate on their studies.  Few apply the money earned to savings
> for college but, rather, spend it almost immediately on
> self-gratifying material goods..  Of all the developed,
> industrialized nations, only the United States allows adolescents to
> put in long hours on jobs rather than in studying, something the
> authors subtly condemn employers for exploiting while continuing to
> undermine the purpose of educating the country's adolescents.
> Further, the study condemns the fact that a significant number of
> students are entirely too involved in extra-curricular activities.
> The authors suggest a formula for parents, limiting to no more than
> ten the number of hours their children may work and/or participate
> in extra-curricular activities.  They also suggest that, contrary to
> popular opinion, students do not watch excessive amounts of
> television and that this was not as major a factor in their lives as
> "just hanging out" with their friends.
> 
> The final chapter lists ten recommendations to remedy the problem.
> They range from "Establishing Academic Excellence as a National
> Priority"  (p.  188) to getting parents directly involved in school
> activities and limiting hours worked outside school.  Included in
> the recommendations is the idea that colleges and universities, as
> an encouragement for students to study, should raise admission
> standards to realistic levels and maintain them regardless of the
> initial disqualification of minimal students.
> 
> This is a powerful book long needed.  It is a breath of fresh air
> after the flood of propaganda by politicians and others that has
> convinced the public that teachers and bad schools are entirely and
> solely at fault for the decline in their children's education.
> Readers need to stay with the text and follow the arguments as they
> build.  The style is not sensational, but rather calm and studied
> and quite convincing.  The research appears to be solid; the
> disquieting conclusions will make some uncomfortable.  In the mind
> of this reviewer, the work is a "must read" for parents and for
> educators anywhere in the system from kindergarten through the
> undergraduate years.
> 
>      Copyright (c) 1996 by H-Net, all rights reserved.  This work
>      may be copied for non-profit educational use if proper credit
>      is given to the author and the list.  For other permission,
>      please contact H-Net@H-Net.MSU.EDU.
> 

From: bidwell@andrews.edu (Daniel R. Bidwell)
Subject: mailing list changes
Date: Thu, 2 Jan 1997 00:21:20 -0500 (EST)

Mail that does pertain to the topic of a mailing list is often called
spam.  We have recently experienced a rash of obscene and commercial
email being sent to some of our mailing lists.  As a result, we are
instituting a "members only" posting policy on all mailing lists that
are not otherwise limited by a moderator or have domain restrictions.
Under the new policy any email that is sent to a list from someone that
is not a member of that list will be sent to the postmaster for approval
before it can be sent to the list members.  This will not affect those
of you that are on the mailing list.

Some mailing lists have a moderator who approves all messages before
they go out.  These will not change.

Some mailing lists are restricted to on campus mail only.  These will
not change either.

If you are a member of a mailing list, but post a message from a
different email address then the one that you receive your list mail on
your mail will not go through without being looked at.

I am sorry for any inconvenience this change may cause.

From: Patricia Scott 
Subject: RE: mailing list changes
Date: Thu, 2 Jan 1997 14:02:51 -0500


------ =_NextPart_000_01BBF8B5.A5951300
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Dan, it doesn't sound like inconvenience to me!  I certainly don't want =
obscene mail, nor do I want somebody else putting it out on "my" list.  =
Keep it up!  Are you the postmaster?  Just wondering who has the nasty =
job of sorting through the garbage.
Happy New Year.
--Patricia

----------
>From: 	Daniel R. Bidwell[SMTP:bidwell@andrews.edu]
Sent: 	Wednesday, January 01, 1997 7:21 PM
To: 	ge@andrews.edu
>Subject: 	mailing list changes

Mail that does pertain to the topic of a mailing list is often called
spam.  We have recently experienced a rash of obscene and commercial
email being sent to some of our mailing lists.  As a result, we are
instituting a "members only" posting policy on all mailing lists that
are not otherwise limited by a moderator or have domain restrictions.
Under the new policy any email that is sent to a list from someone that
is not a member of that list will be sent to the postmaster for approval
before it can be sent to the list members.  This will not affect those
of you that are on the mailing list.

Some mailing lists have a moderator who approves all messages before
they go out.  These will not change.

Some mailing lists are restricted to on campus mail only.  These will
not change either.

If you are a member of a mailing list, but post a message from a
different email address then the one that you receive your list mail on
your mail will not go through without being looked at.

I am sorry for any inconvenience this change may cause.



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------ =_NextPart_000_01BBF8B5.A5951300--

From: bidwell@andrews.edu (Daniel R. Bidwell)
Subject: M-ge: Re: mailing list changes
Date: Thu, 2 Jan 1997 14:56:39 -0500 (EST)

> 
> Dan, it doesn't sound like inconvenience to me!  I certainly don't want =
> obscene mail, nor do I want somebody else putting it out on "my" list.  =
> Keep it up!  Are you the postmaster?  Just wondering who has the nasty =
> job of sorting through the garbage.
> Happy New Year.
> --Patricia
> 
yes, I am the postmaster and there is lots of garbage to sort through
sometimes.

-- 
Daniel R. Bidwell	|	bidwell@andrews.edu
Andrews University	Computer Science & Information Systems Department
If two always agree, one of them is unnecessary
"Friends don't let friends do DOS"
"In theory, theory and practice are the same.
In practice, however, they are not."

From: campbels@andrews.edu (Scott Campbell)
Subject: Disk Usage
Date: Tue, 7 Jan 1997 23:19:21 -0500 (EST)

Hi all.  Each of you are over your allowed 5MB disk usage limit.  Please
download or delete enough to get below it.  This causes us to run out of
room on the disk partition, rendering the accounts on this partion
useless.  Below is a list of disk usages.  Thank you for your cooperation.
Scott

15304   /homes/csu/1994/connorm
12568   /homes/csu/1994/norton
11556   /homes/csu/1995/boyko
10084   /homes/csu/1994/merwin
9576    /homes/csu/1993/wickey
8492    /homes/csu/1994/dodge
8296    /homes/csu/1995/fraizer

-- 
             Scott Campbell
    Computer Science Dept. Supervisor
|----------Andrews University------------|
|Phone: 616-471-3516                     |
|Email: campbels@andrews.edu             |
|Web:   http://www.andrews.edu/~campbels/|
|----------------------------------------|

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: List of Net Sources for Term Papers
Date: Sun, 19 Jan 1997 08:27:07 -0500 (EST)

Hello, Colleagues,

The following is not directly related to GE, but I thought you might
appreciate access to the list.
	Malcolm

> 
> ================= EH.TEACH POSTING =================
> From: "douglas a ley" 
> Date: Thu, 16 Jan 1997 23:47:58 EST
> 
> Fellow H-Teachers,
> 
> Our reference librarian (Tony Krier) here at FPC recently trolled the Web
> and came
> up with a useful list of term paper sites.  The list is being
> distributed to all faculty on our campus, and Tony gladly gave me
> permission to pass his findings onto you.  Some of these sites are
> really quite amazing, including one (#19) in which a Professor Abe
> Korn assures customers that all papers will be written by a professor
> on your behalf.  So, check 'em out.
> 
> 1. ACI Writing Assistance Center Home= http://www.aci-plus.com
> 
> 2. Biology 310-Index of Term Papers 1995=
> http://algodones.unm.edu/~bmilne/bio310/termpapers.1995.html
> 
> 3. Cheap Term Papers= http://www.adgrafix.com:80/users/cheaptermpaper
> 
> 4. Coshe's Reports=
> http://www.mindspring.com/~hednarm/reports/main.htm
> 
> 5. Dave Siegel's Home Page of Research and Term Papers=
> http://www.oxy.edu:80/~dsiegel
> 
> 6. Evil House of Cheat= http://www.CheatHouse.com/
> 
> 7. FTP/BYTOR= ftp://www.openix.com/ftp/bytor/
> 
> 8. High Performance Papers= http://www.execpc.com/~hppapers/
> 
> 9. Michaels Page= http://toto.pitton.com/~michael
> 
> 10. My Collection= http://cygnus.rsabbs.com/~jbagot/my.html
> 
> 11. Paperz.com= http://www.paperz.com/
> 
> 12. School Sucks-Download your Workload= http://www.schoolsucks.com/
> 
> 13. Stop Research Paper Shop=
> http://members.tripod.com/%7ETexasTwister
> 
> 14. Term Paper Emporium= http://cygnus.rsabbs.com/~jbagot/terms1.html
> 
> 15. Term Paper Help!=
> http://ourworld.compuserve.com/hompages/paperstore/
> 
> 16. Term Paper Warehouse= http://www.termpaperwarehouse.com/tpw/
> 
> 17. Term Papers and Research Assistance by Collegiate Care=
> http://www.netstorage.com/collegiatecare/
> 
> 18. Term Papers Exchange (Written to Order) =
> http://www.con2.com.:80/~cyberdent/
> 
> 19. Term Papers, School & Business Help Line=
> http://www.serve.com/doctor/
> 
> 20. Termpapers.On.Line home page= http://www.termpapersonline.com
> 
> 21. The Paper Store (thousands)= http://www.termpapers-on-file.com/
> 
> 22. The Report/Essay Database=
> http://shell.idt.net/~zorro3/reports.html
> 
> Hope I didn't mistype any of the addresses.  At any rate, check them
> out.  Some will even integrate in citations that you specify,
> including journals from your library, thereby making detection more
> difficult.
> 
> Doug Ley
> Franklin Pierce College
> leyda@rindge.fpc.edu
> 
> ============ FOOTER TO EH.TEACH POSTING ============
> For information, send the message "info EH.TEACH" to lists@cs.muohio.edu.
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> End of EH.TEACH Digest 418
> **************************
> 

From: Patricia Scott 
Subject: RE: List of Net Sources for Term Papers
Date: Sun, 19 Jan 1997 19:23:57 -0500


------ =_NextPart_000_01BC063E.51921B40
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Thanks, Malcolm.  Clearly it is time for us to think of alternate methods of assessing students' writing abilities!

----------
>From: 	Malcolm Russell[SMTP:russell@andrews.edu]
Sent: 	Sunday, January 19, 1997 3:27 AM
To: 	ge@andrews.edu
>Subject: 	List of Net Sources for Term Papers

Hello, Colleagues,

The following is not directly related to GE, but I thought you might
appreciate access to the list.
	Malcolm

> 
> ================= EH.TEACH POSTING =================
> From: "douglas a ley" 
> Date: Thu, 16 Jan 1997 23:47:58 EST
> 
> Fellow H-Teachers,
> 
> Our reference librarian (Tony Krier) here at FPC recently trolled the Web
> and came
> up with a useful list of term paper sites.  The list is being
> distributed to all faculty on our campus, and Tony gladly gave me
> permission to pass his findings onto you.  Some of these sites are
> really quite amazing, including one (#19) in which a Professor Abe
> Korn assures customers that all papers will be written by a professor
> on your behalf.  So, check 'em out.
> 
> 1. ACI Writing Assistance Center Home= http://www.aci-plus.com
> 
> 2. Biology 310-Index of Term Papers 1995=
> http://algodones.unm.edu/~bmilne/bio310/termpapers.1995.html
> 
> 3. Cheap Term Papers= http://www.adgrafix.com:80/users/cheaptermpaper
> 
> 4. Coshe's Reports=
> http://www.mindspring.com/~hednarm/reports/main.htm
> 
> 5. Dave Siegel's Home Page of Research and Term Papers=
> http://www.oxy.edu:80/~dsiegel
> 
> 6. Evil House of Cheat= http://www.CheatHouse.com/
> 
> 7. FTP/BYTOR= ftp://www.openix.com/ftp/bytor/
> 
> 8. High Performance Papers= http://www.execpc.com/~hppapers/
> 
> 9. Michaels Page= http://toto.pitton.com/~michael
> 
> 10. My Collection= http://cygnus.rsabbs.com/~jbagot/my.html
> 
> 11. Paperz.com= http://www.paperz.com/
> 
> 12. School Sucks-Download your Workload= http://www.schoolsucks.com/
> 
> 13. Stop Research Paper Shop=
> http://members.tripod.com/%7ETexasTwister
> 
> 14. Term Paper Emporium= http://cygnus.rsabbs.com/~jbagot/terms1.html
> 
> 15. Term Paper Help!=
> http://ourworld.compuserve.com/hompages/paperstore/
> 
> 16. Term Paper Warehouse= http://www.termpaperwarehouse.com/tpw/
> 
> 17. Term Papers and Research Assistance by Collegiate Care=
> http://www.netstorage.com/collegiatecare/
> 
> 18. Term Papers Exchange (Written to Order) =
> http://www.con2.com.:80/~cyberdent/
> 
> 19. Term Papers, School & Business Help Line=
> http://www.serve.com/doctor/
> 
> 20. Termpapers.On.Line home page= http://www.termpapersonline.com
> 
> 21. The Paper Store (thousands)= http://www.termpapers-on-file.com/
> 
> 22. The Report/Essay Database=
> http://shell.idt.net/~zorro3/reports.html
> 
> Hope I didn't mistype any of the addresses.  At any rate, check them
> out.  Some will even integrate in citations that you specify,
> including journals from your library, thereby making detection more
> difficult.
> 
> Doug Ley
> Franklin Pierce College
> leyda@rindge.fpc.edu
> 
> ============ FOOTER TO EH.TEACH POSTING ============
> For information, send the message "info EH.TEACH" to lists@cs.muohio.edu.
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> End of EH.TEACH Digest 418
> **************************
> 



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From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: Drucker's views on the survivability of Universities (fwd)
Date: Sun, 2 Mar 1997 12:02:06 -0500 (EST)

Thanks to Dan Turk for forwarding this,
just after the Board once again raised tuition about inflation..

Forwarded message:
> Hi all,
> 
> Our Chairman here at the CIS department of Georgia State just passed
> this e-mail regarding the future of traditional higher education on to us.
> You might find it interesting.
> 
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Dan Turk            http://cis.gsu.edu/~dturk                Ph.D. Student
> (770) 984-2359            turk@gsu.edu             CIS Dept, Georgia State
> ==========================================================================
> 
> > DRUCKER SAYS "UNIVERSITIES WON'T SURVIVE"
> > 
> > Renowned management consultant and author Peter Drucker says:  "Thirty years
> > from now the big university campuses will be relics.  Universities won't
> > survive.  It's as large a change as when we first got the printed book.  Do
> > you realize that the cost of higher education has risen as fast as the cost
> > of health care? ...  Such totally uncontrollable expenditures, without any
> > visible improvement in either the content or the quality of education, means
> > that the system is rapidly becoming untenable.  Higher education is in deep
> > crisis...  Already we are beginning to deliver more lectures and classes off
> > campus via satellite or two-way video at a fraction of the cost.  The
> > college won't survive as a residential institution. "  (Forbes 10 Mar 97)
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Dick W.
> > 
> > aka Richard Welke	 +1.404.651.3885
> > 			  rwelke@gsu.edu
> > 			  www.cis.gsu.edu/~rwelke
> 

Date: Sun, 2 Mar 1997 12:21:53 +0100
From: mcbride@andrews.edu (Duane C. McBride)
Subject: Re: Drucker's views on the survivability of Universities (fwd)

thanks Malcom.  I am getting this from colleagues around the country.  Do
you have the whole article.  Will mass education kind of be assembly line
quick, just fact filled and only an elite will have the time or resources
to engage in costly careful reflective consciousness in a community of
scholars?  Is he advocating distance learning?

Make sure you send this to the deans and officers.  It is always good to
add stress to their lives; it keeps them sharp.

duane

Date: Mon, 3 Mar 1997 08:32:48 -0500 (EST)
From: Delmer Davis 
Subject: Re: Drucker's views on the survivability of Universities (fwd)



On Sun, 2 Mar 1997, Duane C. McBride wrote:

> thanks Malcom.  I am getting this from colleagues around the country.  Do
> you have the whole article.  Will mass education kind of be assembly line
> quick, just fact filled and only an elite will have the time or resources
> to engage in costly careful reflective consciousness in a community of
> scholars?  Is he advocating distance learning?
> 
> Make sure you send this to the deans and officers.  It is always good to
> add stress to their lives; it keeps them sharp.
> 
> duane
> 
Duane--

Thanks for the stress.

Delmer

Date: Mon, 3 Mar 1997 15:28:40 -0500
From: mutchp@andrews.edu (Patricia Mutch)
Subject: Re: Drucker's views on the survivability of Universities (fwd)

My first reaction to Drucker's bold prophecy is that I'd like to see his 
numbers on the cost of education having risen as fast as the cost of health 
care.   I think that's doubtful.

To say that higher ed costs are uncontrollable is also a major assertion -- 
there are many public colleges and private universities who are finding ways 
to increase efficiencies and control costs.   The university of the 1980's 
may have little future, but what I've observed happening from my exposure to 
date to higher education would say that the university systems in the 90s 
are responding -- albeit that making any type of change in higher education 
is "like herding cats!"

I thought that an analogy I heard at the KSU Chair's Conference earlier in 
February in Orlando might be of interest to this listserv membership.    

Robert Demsky, chair of the Pew Charitable Foundation, gave a plenary in 
which he used the metaphor of the marketplace for the future of 
universities.   He said that in ten years there would be "medallion" 
institutions and "outlet mall" institutions with few in-between survivors.  
Medallion institutions would be analagous to the Neiman-Marcus, Saks Fifth 
Ave., type of stores -- prestigious, name-brand being part of the price, 
etc.   The outlet mall institutions would make their offerings available 
using the Cost + Convenience strategic paradigm.   Outlets would not 
necessarily mean cut-rate quality (you can get some top brand-names in 
outlets today), but they would concern themselves more with productivity and 
price than with the total educational experience.   Transcripts would be 
"heterogenous" with all the difficulties in translation which would result.  
 He wasn't sure how institutions would decide what degree would be 
appropriate to award.    Demsky had some interesting suggestions to make 
about what an institution which conceived of itself as a medallion 
institution would do to maintain its enrollment at a financially viable level.

After hearing his presentation, Ann Gibson, Sy Saliba, and Peter Bath and I 
had an interesting lunch conversation about SDA higher education and this 
metaphor.

My query to the listserv members -- how does Andrews act like a Medalliion 
and how do we act like an Outlet??  How should we think of ourselves??   
What are the ramifications for our vision of general education and the 
"undergraduate experience." What do you think???

Pat Mutch




>Thanks to Dan Turk for forwarding this,
>just after the Board once again raised tuition about inflation..
>
>Forwarded message:
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> Our Chairman here at the CIS department of Georgia State just passed
>> this e-mail regarding the future of traditional higher education on to us.
>> You might find it interesting.
>> 
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Dan Turk            http://cis.gsu.edu/~dturk                Ph.D. Student
>> (770) 984-2359            turk@gsu.edu             CIS Dept, Georgia State
>> ==========================================================================
>> 
>> > DRUCKER SAYS "UNIVERSITIES WON'T SURVIVE"
>> > 
>> > Renowned management consultant and author Peter Drucker says:  "Thirty 
years
>> > from now the big university campuses will be relics.  Universities won't
>> > survive.  It's as large a change as when we first got the printed book.  Do
>> > you realize that the cost of higher education has risen as fast as the cost
>> > of health care? ...  Such totally uncontrollable expenditures, without any
>> > visible improvement in either the content or the quality of education, 
means
>> > that the system is rapidly becoming untenable.  Higher education is in deep
>> > crisis...  Already we are beginning to deliver more lectures and 
classes off
>> > campus via satellite or two-way video at a fraction of the cost.  The
>> > college won't survive as a residential institution. "  (Forbes 10 Mar 97)
>> > 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > Dick W.
>> > 
>> > aka Richard Welke	 +1.404.651.3885
>> > 			  rwelke@gsu.edu
>> > 			  www.cis.gsu.edu/~rwelke
>> 
>
>
Patricia Mutch, Ph.D.
Dean, College of Arts & Sciences
Andrews University
tel 616-471-3411; fax 616-471-6236

From: Daniel E Turk 
Subject: Re: Drucker's views on the survivability of Universities (fwd)
Date: Mon, 3 Mar 1997 15:40:21 -0500 (EST)

Pat Mutch referred to an interesting analogy for higher education: that of
the marketplace, and "medallion" and "outlet" institutions.  I'd like to
suggest, within this metaphor, that there are still other types of
institutions, just as the marketplace has more than just medallion and
outlet stores.  Maybe there is hope for the intermediate type of
educational institution - even within the "marketplace" metaphor...  :)
I hope so, since that is where I see SDA institutions broadly falling.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dan Turk            http://cis.gsu.edu/~dturk                Ph.D. Student
(770) 984-2359            turk@gsu.edu             CIS Dept, Georgia State
==========================================================================

From: Patricia Scott 
Subject: Drucker et al.
Date: Mon, 3 Mar 1997 18:14:13 -0500

Both Drucker and Demsky (via Dean Mutch) have interesting concepts.  I =
certainly concur with Pat that some figures would be nice; certainly the =
salaries of educators have not risen with the same rapidity of health =
care providers. ( As an aside, we have a recruiter for a nurse =
anesthetist program coming on campus who indicates graduates can expect, =
in Tennessee, $65-75,000.00 per year, and as you all know, TN is not the =
highest paying state in the nation. ) Drucker should also consider how =
much of health care costs go to pay for insurance in this increasingly =
litigious society.  Also those of us who are insured have to pay for =
those of us who aren't.  Education doesn't make a neat parallel. =20

Do you suppose there might, however, be some correlation between the =
ideas of do we/don't we do liver transplants for the chronic alcoholic, =
pay for dialysis for people who don't (won't/can't) control their =
intake, and give enormous amounts of financial aid to those who have not =
demonstrated an adequate ability to do college level work?


Back to Demsky:  Is it possible we believe we should be a medallion =
university, think we are a medallion university and behave like a mall?  =


Is the best there is sometimes better than it needs to be to do the job?
Is what is economic and feasible sometimes not good enough to be able to =
do the job?  And then what is the best course of action?

In times of crisis, the strategy of triage is used to treat those who =
have the best chance of surviving. . . .


Thanks to DT for once again getting us into a stimulating discussion.

Date: Sun, 9 Mar 1997 13:21:41 -0500
From: mutchp@andrews.edu (Patricia Mutch)
Subject: Correction

I need to make a correction.   The author of the metaphor of "medallion" and 
"outlet" institutions is Robert Zemsky, not Demsky.   My error.   I 
apologize for the confusion.  Pat
Patricia Mutch, Ph.D.
Dean, College of Arts & Sciences
Andrews University
tel 616-471-3411; fax 616-471-6236

Date: Wed, 9 Apr 1997 10:40:58 -0400 (EDT)
From: John Young 
Subject: M-ge: subscribe


Date: Wed, 9 Apr 1997 12:36:56 -0400 (EDT)
From: Laurie Matacio 
Subject: none


subscribe

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: subscirbe
Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 09:45:46 -0400 (EDT)

subscribe ge johns@andrews.edu

From: russell@andrews.edu (Malcolm Russell)
Subject: subscirbe
Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 09:45:46 -0400 (EDT)

subscribe ge johns@andrews.edu

Date: Fri, 18 Apr 1997 09:21:20 -0400 (EDT)
From: Loretta Johns 
Subject: Discussion Question for GE


Several concerns have come to the GE committee about the numerical values 
(1-2-3-4 credit courses) that lead to odd total numbers and awkward 
combinations of classes (possibility of 6+ classes in a quarter).  We 
have appointed an ad hoc committee to study this problem, and we would 
appreciate your feedback regarding solutions before May 14.  

Reply by e-mail or contact any of the following ad hoc committee 
members--Linda Closser, Jerry Coy, Delmer Davis, or me!

Thanks,

Loretta Johns

From: Patricia Scott 
Subject: RE: Discussion Question for GE
Date: Tue, 22 Apr 1997 10:09:18 -0400


------ =_NextPart_000_01BC4F05.3EABAB80
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I would personally favor nothing less than 3 credit hours.  It is also =
difficult to schedule nursing labs when classes meet four days a week.  =
Could we not think of having two 2-hour sessions for a four hour class?=20
 Are you considering an upper limit on credits as well?  It seems unduly =
harsh to hang GPA's on five credit courses.  Another argument for =
getting rid of the quarter system.  The quarter system keeps nursing =
from many important year-end meetings, as they tend to occur around the =
same time as graduation.

----------
>From: 	Loretta Johns[SMTP:johns@redwood.cc.andrews.edu]
Sent: 	Friday, April 18, 1997 5:21 AM
To: 	ge@andrews.edu
>Subject: 	Discussion Question for GE


Several concerns have come to the GE committee about the numerical =
values=20
(1-2-3-4 credit courses) that lead to odd total numbers and awkward=20
combinations of classes (possibility of 6+ classes in a quarter).  We=20
have appointed an ad hoc committee to study this problem, and we would=20
appreciate your feedback regarding solutions before May 14. =20

Reply by e-mail or contact any of the following ad hoc committee=20
members--Linda Closser, Jerry Coy, Delmer Davis, or me!

Thanks,

Loretta Johns



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Date: Fri, 2 May 1997 09:31:11 -0400 (EDT)
From: Loretta Johns 
Subject: Re: Association for General and Liberal Studies


Interested in presenting a paper at the annual AGLS meetings October 
23-25?  The conference theme is "Power and Identity in the World 
Community:  Globalization and the Academy."  The deadline for submission 
is May 31, 1997.  The theme will be examined from four different 
perspectives:

Culture & Values (Education for world citizenship, Multiculturalism and 
Cosmopolitanism)

Identity (ex:  Globalization:  the psychological perspective -- the view 
from space)

Power (ex:  Democracy and the Individual Voice)

The Planet ( ex:  The Political World vs. The Physical)


Let me know if you are interested in presenting a paper.

Loretta Johns
Director, General Education

Date: Mon, 30 Jun 1997 17:29:59 -0400 (EDT)
From: Thomas Ogwangi 
Subject: Who You Are Makes a Difference

A message that I felt I should share with each of you.  I hope that you 
shall have a good day.

                 	Take care... Thoso
  *-----------------------------------------------------------------*
  *		URL:	 http://www.andrews.edu/~ogwangi/           *
  *  Knowledge without God is but useless. In God we have a future. * 
  *-----------------------------------------------------------------*
>Date: Mon, 30 Jun 1997 15:41:32 -0400 (EDT)
>From: Damaris Ongaga 
To: Thomas Ogwangi 
>Subject: Who You Are Makes a Difference (fwd)

               Who You Are Makes A Difference...

A teacher in New York decided to honor each of her seniors in high school
by telling them the difference they each made.  Using a process developed
by Helice Bridges of Del Mar, California, she called each student to the
front of the class, one at a time.  First she told them how the student
made a difference to her and the class.  Then she presented each of them
with a blue ribbon imprinted with gold letters which read, "Who I Am Makes
a Difference."

Afterwards the teacher decided to do a class project to see what kind of
impact recognition would have on a community.  She gave each of the
students three more ribbons and instructed them to go out and spread this
acknowledgment ceremony.  Then they were to follow up on the results, see
who honored whom and report back to the class in about a week.

One of the boys in the class went to a junior executive in a nearby
company and honored him for helping him with his career planning. He gave
him a blue ribbon and put it on his shirt.  Then he gave him two extra
ribbons, and said, "We're doing a class project on recognition, and we'd
like you to go out, find somebody to honor, give them a blue ribbon, then
give them the extra blue ribbon so they can acknowledge a third person to
keep this acknowledgment ceremony going.  Then please report back to me
and tell me what happened."

Later that day the junior executive went in to see his boss, who had been
noted, by the way, as being kind of a grouchy fellow.  He sat his boss
down and he told him that he deeply admired him for being a creative
genius.  The boss seemed very surprised.  The junior executive asked him
if he would accept the gift of the blue ribbon and would he give him
permission to put it on him.  His surprised boss said, "Well, sure."

The junior executive took the blue ribbon and placed it right on his
boss's jacket above his heart.  As he gave him the last extra ribbon, he
said, "Would you do me a favor?  Would you take this extra ribbon and pass
it on by honoring somebody else?  The young boy who first gave me the
ribbons is doing a project in school and we want to keep this recognition
ceremony going and find out how it affects people."

That night the boss came home to his 14-year-old son and sat him down.  He
said, "The most incredible thing happened to me today.  I was in my office
and one of the junior executives came in and told me he admired me and
gave me a blue ribbon for being a creative genius. Imagine.  He thinks I'm
a creative genius.  Then he put this blue ribbon that says 'Who I Am Makes
A Difference' on my jacket above my heart.  He gave me an extra ribbon and
asked me to find somebody else to honor.  As I was driving home tonight, I
started thinking about whom I would honor with this ribbon and I thought
about you. I want to honor you.

"My days are really hectic and when I come home I don't pay a lot of
attention to you.  Sometimes I scream at you for not getting good enough
grades in school and for your bedroom being a mess, but somehow tonight, I
just wanted to sit here and, well, just let you know that you do make a
difference to me.  besides your mother, you are the most important person
in my life.  You're a great kid and I love you!"

The startled boy started to sob and sob, and he couldn't stop crying.  His
whole body shook.  He looked up at his father and said through his tears,
"I was planning on committing suicide tomorrow, Dad, because I didn't
think you loved me.  Now I don't need to."
                                                           -Helice Bridges


You are under no obligation to send this on to two people
or to two hundred.  As far as I am concerned, you can delete it and move
on to the next message.  But if you have anyone who means a lot to you, I
encourage you to send them this message and let them know.  You never know
what kind of difference a little encouragement can make to a person.  Send
it to all of the people who mean anything important to you, or send it to
the one or two people who mean the most.  Stick on a little message of why
they are so special or just forward it to them.  Or just smile and know
that someone thinks that you are important, or you wouldn't have received
this in the first place.  :) 

From: 
Date: Thu, 13 Aug 1998 11:36:49 -0400 (EDT)
Subject:   Certified by: (KeyID: F72ED579)

  Certified by: Cisco Systems Product Security Incident Response Team 
  Certified by: (KeyID: 8E671A21)
  Certified by: (KeyID: 1C0FB709)
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cles


From: spk99@usa.net
Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1998 03:36:24 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: M-ge: RE: DISCOUNT SOFTWARE




From: clvr98@usa.net
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1998 23:48:42 -0500
Subject: M-ge: RE: DISCOUNT SOFTWARE


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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 11:34:25 -0400
From: Douglas Crawford 
Subject: ITS Communication

I am writing this letter to open a road or roads of communication that I
believe need to be opened.  I am not writing this as a finger pointing
letter, but as one to show a problem that we can hopefully work
together, as a team, to develop a solution.

There are two distinct groups in ITS, (more, but this only concerns
two), that of Networking and PC Support.  I want to stress a need for
further communication between the two.

Some ideas I have had are monthly meetings, or an e-mail list of some
sort.

These are ideas which may help us to better communicate between our
groups.  Other possibilities are Helpdesk integration or even short
weekly meetings.

I don't present these as ethereal ideas for perceived inadequacies, but
as hopeful solutions to real problems.

I don't know how these problems affect Networking, for I am not in
communication enough with them to begin to postulate any ideas, but I
can speak for my group when I say that this lack of communication is
hindering our performance.

One possible improvement is for PC Support to be made aware of changes
that are done that possibly could, or definitely will, impact our direct
area of responsibility.

Two cases in point, which I bring up not to accuse but to highlight what
I am referring to, are:  1) the proxy incident in which we received
several complaints about, and after researching, found out it was a
server malfunction.  If we had been alerted of the mishap earlier, we
could have passed that on to all of our customers, thereby relieving
tension and speculation from the student body.  (An interesting side
note is that by chance one of our students convinced another student not
to print an editorial of how ITS was blocking Sabbath browsing.  That
would have been very bad press, and it's a perfect example of how a
little bit of communication ahead of time could prevent a lot of
clean-up afterwards.)  2) the Lamson incident, where Networking was in
the middle of converting them over from an old 3.11 server to a new ITS
server for central administration.  The process was incomplete, and PC
Support received calls, and as it was my building I responded, and had
to track down who was doing what to the network, and why.  Then, I was
forced to explain to Dean Faehner that I couldn't help, and I had to
contact the people responsible.  This made ITS as a whole look very
unorganized, and sloppy.

I think a good starting point would be to inform each other if one of
our groups makes a change that would impact directly the services or
responsibilities of the other one, or even if a failure or change in
status occurs that has a similar effect, if one group realizes it first,
the other should be made aware.

I want to open this to discussion, either in a group meeting or by
replying to this group letter, but I feel this has become a problem that
needs to be dealt with, and all of us working together can accomplish
much more than any one of us working alone.

Sincerely,
Douglas Crawford


From: "David Heise" 
Subject: RE: ITS Communication
Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 11:48:03 -0400

Thank you Douglas for being willing to share your thoughts on this important
matter.  Lack of communication and trust can be devastating in any context,
and good communications never comes about spontaneously - we all have to
work on it consciously.  All of us need to think of ways that might be
achieved, and then come together to agree on a plan that all of us can work
with.

David

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Douglas Crawford [mailto:douglasc@andrews.edu]
> Sent: Tuesday, 20 October, 1998 11:34 AM
> To: dheise@andrews.edu; lorena@andrews.edu; widner@andrews.edu;
> ttrine@andrews.edu; bowman@andrews.edu; nelsonv@andrews.edu;
> dodge@andrews.edu; lim@andrews.edu; douglasc@andrews.edu;
> cress@andrews.edu; swenson@andrews.edu; bidwell@andrews.edu;
> claytonb@andrews.edu
> Subject: ITS Communication
>
>
> I am writing this letter to open a road or roads of communication that I
> believe need to be opened.  I am not writing this as a finger pointing
> letter, but as one to show a problem that we can hopefully work
> together, as a team, to develop a solution.
>
> There are two distinct groups in ITS, (more, but this only concerns
> two), that of Networking and PC Support.  I want to stress a need for
> further communication between the two.
>
> Some ideas I have had are monthly meetings, or an e-mail list of some
> sort.
>
> These are ideas which may help us to better communicate between our
> groups.  Other possibilities are Helpdesk integration or even short
> weekly meetings.
>
> I don't present these as ethereal ideas for perceived inadequacies, but
> as hopeful solutions to real problems.
>
> I don't know how these problems affect Networking, for I am not in
> communication enough with them to begin to postulate any ideas, but I
> can speak for my group when I say that this lack of communication is
> hindering our performance.
>
> One possible improvement is for PC Support to be made aware of changes
> that are done that possibly could, or definitely will, impact our direct
> area of responsibility.
>
> Two cases in point, which I bring up not to accuse but to highlight what
> I am referring to, are:  1) the proxy incident in which we received
> several complaints about, and after researching, found out it was a
> server malfunction.  If we had been alerted of the mishap earlier, we
> could have passed that on to all of our customers, thereby relieving
> tension and speculation from the student body.  (An interesting side
> note is that by chance one of our students convinced another student not
> to print an editorial of how ITS was blocking Sabbath browsing.  That
> would have been very bad press, and it's a perfect example of how a
> little bit of communication ahead of time could prevent a lot of
> clean-up afterwards.)  2) the Lamson incident, where Networking was in
> the middle of converting them over from an old 3.11 server to a new ITS
> server for central administration.  The process was incomplete, and PC
> Support received calls, and as it was my building I responded, and had
> to track down who was doing what to the network, and why.  Then, I was
> forced to explain to Dean Faehner that I couldn't help, and I had to
> contact the people responsible.  This made ITS as a whole look very
> unorganized, and sloppy.
>
> I think a good starting point would be to inform each other if one of
> our groups makes a change that would impact directly the services or
> responsibilities of the other one, or even if a failure or change in
> status occurs that has a similar effect, if one group realizes it first,
> the other should be made aware.
>
> I want to open this to discussion, either in a group meeting or by
> replying to this group letter, but I feel this has become a problem that
> needs to be dealt with, and all of us working together can accomplish
> much more than any one of us working alone.
>
> Sincerely,
> Douglas Crawford
>
>

Date: Tue, 01 Dec 1998 17:03:53 -0500
From: Dan Widner 
Subject: Pager Numbers

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------2F2CEE20AA92F7ABE3D25C2D
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--
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dan Widner
Assistant Director for Client Service
widner@andrews.edu
616-471-6016
----------------------------------------------------------------------------



--------------2F2CEE20AA92F7ABE3D25C2D
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--------------2F2CEE20AA92F7ABE3D25C2D--

Date: Wed, 02 Dec 1998 09:12:08 -0500
From: Dan Widner 
Subject: Pager #s

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------59EB5B2DE514A3ECC475892B
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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I tried sending this yesterday and it apparently bounced.  If you are
getting this twice it is a copy of the first one.

--
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dan Widner
Assistant Director for Client Service
widner@andrews.edu
616-471-6016
----------------------------------------------------------------------------



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--------------59EB5B2DE514A3ECC475892B--

Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 10:11:17 -0500
From: Douglas Crawford 
Subject: Integrating Windows NT Server 4.0 with NetWare, Unix, and IBM Operating 

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http://www.microsoft.com/ntserver/nts/exec/overview/NTInterop/
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	exec/overview/NTInterop/"












Integrating Windows NT Server 4.0 with NetWare,  Unix,  and IBM Op=
erating Systems










=20

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Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 16:44:59 -0500
From: Lorena Bidwell 
Subject: Spring Quarter Class Lists in WebCT


Faculty and Support Staff with WebCT Courses,

    We are working to provide class lists loaded into WebCT so that you do not have to enter your students.  For Spring quarter, 1999, if you are planning to use a WebCT class and would like the students loaded for you automatically, please email me and indicate the Course number and section out of the class schedule that matches your WebCT course.  We will load these after the end of registration on Tuesday.
    Don't hesitate to contact me with any questions,
 Lorena
 

--
Lorena Bidwell
Assistant Director for Instructional Technology
Information Technology Services
Andrews University
lorena@andrews.edu
(616) 471-6114
 

From: Vaughan Nelson 
Subject: Nextel # and ID
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 12:02:04 -0400 (EDT)

We got me hooked up with the radio feature... Here's the new info in
case anyone was interested:

Phone Number		Private ID
208-6126		26126

Have a great weekend...

-- 
Vaughan Nelson
PC Support Specialist
Information Technology Services
Andrews University

Date: Mon, 28 Jun 1999 12:02:26 -0400
From: Lorena Bidwell 
Subject: WebCT Course July 5-9

Faculty and Staff Involved in using WebCT courses,
  There is a 1 week intensive class being offered July 5-9 on campus
called  EDCI689 Seminar in Technology: WebCT.  It is from 1:30-5:20
Monday through Friday.  The main components of WebCT will be covered
Monday through Wednesday with lab time and advanced topics on Thursday
and student presentations on Friday.  We have space available for some
faculty and staff to also attend.  Please contact me if you are
interested in attending this class.  
  If you have other needs for training, feel free to contact me as well
and I'll be happy to do what I can to provide for these needs.
  Hope you all are enjoying your summer and have some time planned for
relaxing!
    Lorena
-- 
Lorena Bidwell 
Assistant Director for Instructional Technology
Information Technology Services
Andrews University
lorena@andrews.edu 
(616) 471-6114

From: Dan Widner 
Subject: Nextel phone problems
Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 11:46:05 -0400

This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.

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For garbled 2-communications, "System Busy" when trying to place calls, or
incoming calls being send directly to voice mail

call Renee   248-359-3742  to report them  refer to trouble ticket #
10142660.

Garbled or system busy reports she wants the number we are trying to
contact.

Regards,

Dan Widner
Assistant Director for Client Services
x6016
 <> 

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BEGIN:VCARD
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N:Widner;Dan
FN:Dan Widner
EMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:widner@helpdesk.cc.andrews.edu
REV:19990614T143300Z
END:VCARD

------_=_NextPart_000_01BEC30F.A9D1BE40--

Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2000 16:23:12 -0400
From: Virginia Nachreiner 
Subject: [Fwd: academy]

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I am supposed to be an administrator on the ACAD1 server.  Did someone
change it inadvertently?

Ginny Nachreiner

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Received: from andrews.edu by redwood.cs.andrews.edu (8.8.8+Sun) id QAA04309; Mon, 31 Jul 2000 16:10:28 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from orion.cc.andrews.edu (orion.cc.andrews.edu [143.207.5.12])
	by trumpkin.cs.andrews.edu (8.9.3+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA06647
	for ; Mon, 31 Jul 2000 16:12:39 -0400 (EDT)
Received: by orion.cc.andrews.edu (8.8.8+Sun) id QAA22416; Mon, 31 Jul 2000 16:12:38 -0400 (EDT)
>Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2000 16:12:37 -0400 (EDT)
>From: Reg Swensen 
To: Virginia Nachreiner 
>Subject: Re: academy
In-Reply-To: <3985D46F.9D0AE03C@andrews.edu>
Message-ID: 
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000

I didnt... Check with Terry Dodge...

Reg S.


On Mon, 31 Jul 2000, Virginia Nachreiner wrote:

> Hi, Reg,
> Did someone change something with the ACAD1 server?  I no longer seem to
> be an administrator on it.
> 
> Ginny
> 


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--------------3C8A3F30C2CC380D3EBC7F93--

Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2000 15:22:36 -0400
From: Lorena Bidwell 
Subject: Re: WebCT

Dave,
  I just did a quick look and Travis Barker is in the list of registered
students with tdbarker as a user name.  If you get into the WebCT
course, click on Course Management, Student Mgmt, Students, Import from
Global DB and enter your course and section number again and click on
Select, it should load any students in who are registered, but not yet
in your WebCT course.  If you have already done this and Travis' name
doesn't get loaded, let me know and we'll check into it further.
    Lorena

Dave Village wrote:
> 
> Hi Dan,
> 
> After downloading my student roster, one student, Travis Barker, does
> not have a global ID. He says he is using his andrews email account.  He
> is not able to take the quiz for Ther Appliances.  How to fix?
> 
> --
> David Village                   email: village@andrews.edu

-- 
Lorena Bidwell 
Director for Instructional Technology
Information Technology Services
Andrews University
lorena@andrews.edu 
(616) 471-6114